100 Episodes In - Looking Back, Moving Forward

Intro Music 0:07

Straight down the middle. It went straight down the middle. Then it started to hook just a week.

Mike Gonzalez 0:16

Well, welcome to another edition of For the Good of the Game. Bruce Devlin, can you believe that we've already released 100 episodes since starting our podcast back in April?

Bruce Devlin 0:30

Well, when you called me and suggested doing a podcast, I thought you were crazy. But uh agreed to go along with you because I I knew you probably had a pretty good idea what might happen, but I I'm telling you, the guys that uh the guys have been so great to us. They've given of their time, they've told us all the little intricate stories about some of the great things that happened to them. Some good, some bad on the golf course, but it's been a pleasure talking with them, and boy, we've covered a lot of great players.

Mike Gonzalez 1:06

Well, we sure have, and and you know, looking back uh to that time back in April, or a little before, I guess, I I know we had a couple of phone conversations about doing something, and uh I don't remember specifically how the idea got into my head to do a podcast. I do remember that uh I'll I found I I had found myself with uh a lot of time on my hands because uh several of my uh responsibilities were were behind me, and I woke up one morning and said, Man, I I need something to do, or I'm gonna go crazy. And I thought about I don't know why, thought about a podcast. For people that have heard our original trailer, uh, we did talk a little bit about perhaps it'll be interviews with PGA stars, but also maybe talk about uh golf travel in the UK. Well, we sort of set that aside, didn't we? Because we've we've really sort of found our groove with these interviews.

Bruce Devlin 2:00

Yeah, well, the uh like I said uh originally, the the guys have been just uh I mean, you know, the f some of these guys have sat with us for a couple of hours, you know, and they've talked talked about uh how they first started in the game and who was their major influence and uh certain guys that w, you know, have really helped them a great deal. Uh it's been a very, very interesting uh set of uh podcasts, in my opinion. Uh it's been great doing them with these guys. They've been fabulous.

Mike Gonzalez 2:31

So what what were your initial thoughts when I I posed the question about doing a podcast back in April? Did you did you think I was crazy or did you see where this might uh end up?

Bruce Devlin 2:44

Well, to be honest with you, I was uh I wasn't expecting it, that's for sure. But then when I got to thinking about it, I've always felt like I've had uh I've had a pretty good rapport with with all of my peers. Uh I know you know, I love the game and uh obviously they've loved the game to have to have you know used golf as a way to make a living. So I thought, you know, maybe maybe I can uh you know lean on some of these guys to do a podcast with us and and it's uh that's exactly what's happened. You know, they've they've been uh they've been very forward with us and it's been great.

Mike Gonzalez 3:24

It hasn't taken a lot of leaning either, has it? I mean these guys have been very receptive to your calls.

Bruce Devlin 3:32

Yeah, they have been. Uh you know, w when you think about some of the things that these guys have I mean, they remember the most intricate details about some of the shots that I hit. You know, case in point, be the right club today that that Hal Sutton, you know, when he hit that six on at the last hole at the uh at the players' championship, I mean, you know, you could see the emotion uh j just pouring out of him after he hit that shot. And and you could hear it again when he was recalling it when we talked with him. So, you know, things like that. And then uh I mean uh one of the great shots that I remember watching even, I played in the I I didn't play in the open, but uh I watched Corey Paven hit that second shot at Shinnecock with a forward to about three feet. Uh I mean well, that's one of the greatest golf shots that's you know that's ever been hit to win an open championship.

Mike Gonzalez 4:29

It sure was.

Bruce Devlin 4:30

It's it's been a lot of fun.

Mike Gonzalez 4:32

Yeah, we have relived with these guys some just some great, great golf moments in golf history. Um, you know, going back to April, we think about what we set out to do, and as I mentioned, we had sort of a two-pronged approach which has gravitated toward just focusing on these uh these interviews, and we'll talk about that in a minute. There are some, as we did our research on this space, because we're really sort of in this telling the golf history space, aren't we? We're telling these guys' stories. Um so that's been the focus. And you know, there's a couple of other, I think, history-oriented podcasts that uh one's been around for a while, one not quite as as long. And I want to give a shout-out to Connor T. Lewis. Connor uh formed a group called the Society of Golf Historians and does a podcast called Talkin' Golf History, which has been out there for three or four years. And he talks uh typically a little older golf history, you know, talks about some of the great architects of the game, some of the great early players of the game, like an Alan Robertson or the Morrises or uh people like that. And uh but he has on occasion talked to uh uh guys uh that we know and have talked to, guys like Dean Beaman, Tony Jackl, and he just finished an interview with with Al Al Geyberger, and so uh in the same space, but they've they've done a nice job capturing golf history. Uh the RNA also sponsors a podcast called the Open Podcast, where they try to go out and and tell the story of the various opens of the past, talking to either the champion or maybe some other major figure in that uh in that. But but other than that, that seems to be the only podcast really focused on talking golf history. And that's what we're trying to do. We're we're trying to uh with these pros of yesteryear tell their story, their not just their golf story, but their life story. And as you said, these guys have been j very generous with your time. I mean, it's rare unless we've pre scheduled a time slot and then agreed to come back to these guys. It's rare that we don't go two hours plus with these guys, isn't it?

Bruce Devlin 6:36

Yeah, it is. And uh, you know, we we've I mean you cover the history we we really are covering the history of the game from you know sort of the mid early to mid-sixties up until pretty much up until uh you know today. Uh not with a lot of the younger players. When we say younger players, I'm talking about guys younger than 50.

SPEAKER_03 7:02

Right.

Bruce Devlin 7:02

Uh not too not too many of them, but uh it's it it really, you know, look of what we've done, what 31 guests that we've interviewed. Uh 12 of the 31 living Hall of Fame guys. We've interviewed 12 of the 31 of them. So, you know, it's uh pretty pretty nice.

Mike Gonzalez 7:26

Yeah, and uh, you know, continuing along with with some of this, just the statistics from the uh first 100 episodes, uh, we also went back and found that there's still 111 living winners of majors, and we've interviewed about a quarter of them so far, and uh that's part of the aim, which we'll talk about later in terms of the future, you know, what we're looking to do. Um, but our guests have won a lot of stuff, haven't they, Bruce?

Bruce Devlin 7:53

Well, they've won uh 73 majors, 409 PGA tour events, and a thousand twelve worldwide professional golf wins. Now, that's a that's a lot of talent, boy.

Mike Gonzalez 8:11

And it's a lot of stories, too, isn't it? Because you think about uh talking to guys that have won 73 majors, we've specifically talked about just about each one of those, too, with these guys, haven't we?

Bruce Devlin 8:23

That's right, we have too. And uh it's uh you know, I keep repeating myself, I know, but uh, I mean they've they've just been so so wonderful to to the both of us and given us given us their time and uh and thoughts about their history in this wonderful game of golf.

Mike Gonzalez 8:40

You know, we talked when we uh as we were getting started about where our focus ought to be, and and uh we produced some lists for ourselves that listed uh World Hall, Golf Hall of Fame members, uh major championship winners. We we sort of did it by date of birth so that we could identify some of the guys that were a little bit older and and uh uh want to be able to tell their stories while we have them around. We sort of focused initially, and I kept looking at the the the 100 major championships uh that were contested between the years 1960 and 1984. I mean, we we we do go back to like a Gary Player that won before 1960, but for the most part, focusing on those 100 majors. And what we found were that that the winners of 72 of those 100 majors are still with us. And we've talked to the winners of 54 of those majors.

Bruce Devlin 9:34

Yeah, that's pretty pretty nice, isn't it?

Mike Gonzalez 9:37

So we've uh we've got a lot uh that we've been able to accomplish, Bruce, uh uh by the time our listeners hear this uh updated trailer, I guess as we call it, looking back on the first 100. It's been about a 50-50 split between full episodes released. We did 49 of those so far that are recorded and released, and 51 of what we call the short tracks. Now, the the short tracks was this is uh something we hadn't really thought about when we started, but uh we've had some fun with those, haven't we?

Bruce Devlin 10:09

Yeah, they've been great. Uh I mean I've had a lot of the guys that that we've interviewed call and say, you know, I I've I listened to that short track. That's you know, that's a great way of uh promoting the podcast itself, and it really has been it's been been terrific. And you know, we're we've we've covering a lot of people, you know. We're uh we've got listeners in uh fifty-eight countries. Fifty-eight countries and twenty-seven hundred plus cities around the world. Now that's uh I never expected it to be quite honest with you. No, I didn't. I I thought there's no way that we'd we'd reach that far, but uh and I and I think part of it is the history of some of the uh international players that have come over here and played on the PGA tour, and they've got friends all around the world, and they hear podcasts from say a Tony Jacqueline, and we get people from England that are very, very interested in in listening to podcasts. And I think that's that's how we've uh ended up reaching those 2,700 cities.

Mike Gonzalez 11:15

Yeah, I think you're right, Bruce. Um, and you know, there are uh there are rankings that are available if you look on Apple or some of the other major podcast platforms, which we try to keep track of. Not so much because we want to get ranked high necessarily, that doesn't do us much, except in the case of uh platforms like Apple, the higher you're ranked, obviously, the higher uh you are up in the list of people that are looking for podcasts to listen to. And so there is some benefit if we want more listeners to get as high in the rankings as we can. What we found is that for people who will subscribe and or follow us and our podcast, that's what really makes a difference in the rankings. But I've been encouraged to see that for the most part, we consistently rank in the top 50 in just about every major English-speaking country in the world. And you would expect with your roots in Australia, we cover Australia, New Zealand very well, but Canada, the UK, the US, all uh consistently ranked in the in the top 50. And you know, I don't know what I expected uh coming into this, Bruce, but um uh I'm sure I'm I'm sure pleased with those results so far.

Bruce Devlin 12:23

Yeah, and we you know we've got a lot of uh we've got a lot more guys that I've had the uh fortune to talk to. You know, we got guys like Bobby Nichols and Lee Jansen, a two-time open champion winner, Steve Stricker, who just captained the Ryder Cup uh a few months ago, Stads, the great Craig Stadler, and Davis Love, the third. Uh hopefully we we haven't been able to talk to Johnny Miller, but uh we we certainly hope to get him and Lou Graham and uh our 63 open champion winner, Bob Charles. He'll be on with us in the the middle to late part of February. And uh the one guy that I'm um I'm having trouble corralling is that Lee Trevino. Now we had him, as you know, we had him set up to do one of the first three podcasts, and then he something happened and he had to back out, and I've been chasing him ever since, but I'll get him. He can't run as quick as I can.

SPEAKER_03 13:28

I think he was the first guy to say that. So that'll be fun to do. Yeah, he he was our.

Bruce Devlin 13:32

Yeah, and he'll be he'll be just he'll be fun to do it with, too.

Mike Gonzalez 13:37

Yeah. You know, I started reflecting back on some of the things that we've come to learn just uh having started this back a few months ago. And and there's a lot we have. As you mentioned, the the one thing that really struck me was uh not not only how generous these guys are with their time, but they uh they enjoy telling their stories. I mean, once they get into it, uh they really have a good time sort of taking themselves back to that day and and and life on tour and the camaraderie and the fellowship and the competition. They just seem to really relish that.

Bruce Devlin 14:10

And even uh, you know, they I got I get a kick out of listening to them uh about when they first started to play the game. A lot of them didn't play golf originally, they played other sports. Everyone that did that, by the way, uh they were they thought that that was a great way to s to get into golf, having gone through the uh the teams, the team sport business, you know, playing baseball and uh basketball. Uh, you know, and then others, you know, started playing when they were three and four years old. So there's a diverse way of uh the guys getting into the professional game. It's been been very, very interesting.

Mike Gonzalez 14:52

There really is probably uh maybe one of the the guys who came upon the game later than most, you think about Larry Nelson, his experience uh Vietnam coming back, and then you know.

Bruce Devlin 15:06

Boy, what a what a story, you know. He and to have the record that he's had has been amazing. He's uh and he was like all of them so generous with his time. And you know, and uh I I know you know, but uh yeah, I'm involved a little bit with the Ben Hogan company. And we we had we were fortunate enough to talk to Robert Stennett, who uh who's the executive director of the Ben Hogan Foundation here in Fort Worth. And uh he you know, part of uh part of Larry's history was that he he was uh he he went to uh basic training in Fort Hood. And uh that's where the Ben Hogan Foundation holds a golf tournament for all of our all of our guys that protect us uh around the world. And and I think next year, I think Larry may come back and uh and uh relive some of the memories when he was there uh when he was a young man, when he was 20 year old, 18-year-old, I guess he was when he went there.

Mike Gonzalez 16:09

Yeah, yeah. I hope he's able to make that happen in his schedule this year. Uh uh, you know, looking back on on this body of interviews, if you think about 31 guests, of course, that includes you, and we did a four-part series on you. Unfortunately, the the earlier ones that we did, uh the ones in person, the ones with you telling your story, the ones we did down in Dallas with uh with uh David Graham and and Robert Stennet and Lanny Watkins, we don't have it, we don't have any video for those. It's just audio only because we weren't toting cameras around and we weren't using this riverside platform.

Bruce Devlin 16:42

Right.

Mike Gonzalez 16:44

So we don't have video, uh, but we've got some great audio and and uh uh those were some fun interviews to do. It's a different dynamic, isn't it, when you can get in the same room with these guys.

Bruce Devlin 16:56

Yeah, it is. But you know something? Uh uh you know the Riverside FM where where we all hook up one another. Uh is it's great to be able to see all three of us together. Uh it's sort of like a semi-Zoom call, I suppose, but uh it's uh it's it's fun to be able to see the guys when you're talking to them rather than you know talking over a phone or something.

Mike Gonzalez 17:22

I think another thing that I've learned is, and I guess it was to be expected, but uh uh most of these guys are not uh very technically proficient, are they?

Bruce Devlin 17:34

No, that's true. Well, join the club. I'm not I'm a bit that way too, and I thank you for for for all the work that you do, uh uh audio-wise and computer-wise with with all these guys. You're the one you you know, you're the nuts and bolts part of this group, and it's been a been a great pleasure, Mike, working with you. It's been a it's been fun. I had no earthly idea what this was going to turn into, but it's but it's really been very, very nice. And I thank you for all your hard work.

Mike Gonzalez 18:05

Well, it has been fun. And uh, you know, I just think about some of the stuff we go through, you know, for our listeners. We uh generally try to do a test hookup with our guests to make sure that uh they know how to get onto the platform with us. We'll be ready to go when all of us are scheduled to record our interview. And uh I have to say we had some some problems with a couple of our guests. And Bruce, I don't know about you, but these would be two guys that I wouldn't expect to have the patience of Job, but they did. And one was Dean Beaman. I spent an hour and 40 minutes with Dean trying to get him hooked up. He ended up going over to a neighbor's house and using their computer, and the other one was Curtis Strange.

SPEAKER_04 18:46

Borrowing their computer.

Mike Gonzalez 18:49

And and and Curtis Strange and I, we spent uh oh, at least over an hour. And uh uh, of course, speaking to Curtis Strange, the first interview we did with him, uh, it's the only time it's happened, but we lost you about 10 minutes in, didn't we?

Bruce Devlin 19:04

That's right. Yeah, yeah. My I don't know. I have no idea about it all. So I mean, that's why I'm happy that you're doing it with me, because I I'd be lost, like a lot of the guys are lost.

Mike Gonzalez 19:19

Well, you know, the it's the only one we've kind of just winged it, and and so Curtis and I just pressed on and we we did a uh a bit more, uh just the two of us, and then of course we were able to get him back together with the three of us to kind of uh uh do the rest of the story. A couple of other uh remembrances are we had a couple of guys that did the interviews from their from their automobiles.

Bruce Devlin 19:41

Yeah, that I was just gonna say was sitting in his Tesla, yeah uh doing the interview, which I thought was very interesting.

Mike Gonzalez 19:51

Yeah, and and if you remember, I think I think Nathaniel Crosby, as we talked to him right before the Walker Cup, he did the same thing. He went out into his car and did the interview in his car.

Bruce Devlin 20:01

That's true, he did, yeah, when it was nice and quiet. Yeah, yeah. So it's been uh it's been fun doing it.

Mike Gonzalez 20:08

It has, and and yeah, you mentioned some of the some of the great stories we've heard. Of course, we talked to Ben Crenshaw and and uh so many great stories around him, both Masters wins, particularly the one uh coming on the heels of the Harvey uh Pinock uh uh funeral. He and Tom Kite went down there. That was quite a story.

Bruce Devlin 20:28

Uh it was quite a story, and uh yeah, you know, and that's uh I said to Ben the other day who had his uh 70th birthday, right? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, he had his 70th birthday. Uh I called him out and said, you know, I remember when uh you were in college at Texas and uh the NCAAs were in uh on the west coast of Florida, I think they were in uh I'm not sure whether they were in Tampa or St. Pete, one or the other. But uh at that time I was under contract with Spalding and I went over there and did a uh did a clinic for the NCAA boys and Crenshaw and Kite were both sitting on the ground uh and I was doing a doing a uh a little uh clinic for them, which I reminded Ben of that, you know, it's been nearly 50 years. It's it's remarkable.

Mike Gonzalez 21:23

Pretty incredible. Uh of course you remember talking to fellow Aussie, Steve Elkington, and of course when you talk to Steve Elkington, uh the stories of Jackie Burke and Jimmy Demerit are gonna come out.

Bruce Devlin 21:35

Yeah, yeah, boy, some great ones. Yeah, and the because I think you know, the the Sutton story too with uh with Jackie Burke is one of the great stories when uh you know, where he where he ended up slapping him and you know, when he kept on missing a putton and he said to Sutton, you know, does that hurt? And Sutton said, Of course it hurts. He said, Well, it oughta hurt when you miss those six and eight footers as well.

Mike Gonzalez 22:00

Well, yeah, he who he whopped him up the side of the head pretty well, didn't he?

Bruce Devlin 22:08

Yeah, he sure did.

Mike Gonzalez 22:10

It was it was fun for me to do this the first one in person. I guess the we would give David Graham the credit of really being our first official guest. We did that one in person, and it was uh apparent to me how close you two guys were. Uh you both go back a long ways. Uh it was interesting to hear him uh really sort of get emotional, reflecting back on his early days, but also on his success and of ultimately getting recognized by the World Golf Hall of Fame. Uh a couple of great major championships that we recounted uh from Oakland Hills and Marion with him.

Bruce Devlin 22:46

Yeah, terrific. Well, and and the one thing that sticks in my mind more than anything else is that uh uh when he was a very young man, uh he before Gloria and I moved to the United States in 1968, he he came by my house or our house in Canberra and stole a golf club out of my collection. Uh and and I'm not sure I I I don't quite recall which one it was, but uh he went he went downstairs where I had all my clubs in a in a closet and he went started rooting around in there and finally found one he thought he liked. So uh I'll always remember that too. Yeah, he know, you know, we're we're very close. Still are.

Mike Gonzalez 23:32

Yep, and he credits you with uh with uh helping him uh sort of transition his game to be ready to play on the American circuit.

Bruce Devlin 23:43

Yeah, well that that all uh that was the uh that happened after he and I won the World Cup down in Argentina in uh 1970. And he asked me, was uh you know, would I suggest he do something to his golf game? And I said to him, uh yeah, I do. I've I got a couple of ideas, but I'm not sure so sure you want to do them. When I told him about what I thought he should do, he he was he said, okay, let's do it. Sounds sounds like it's gonna be hard, but let's do it. So we took him from a flat, closed golf swing to a more upright swing, got a little closer to the ball, and boy, he turned into be just a real bulldog on the golf course. What a great player.

Mike Gonzalez 24:30

How about visiting with Gary Player? I guess that's the one interview of the 31 guys we've talked to where I just sort of set the script aside.

Bruce Devlin 24:40

Yep. And, you know, he he recalled he recalled coming to Australia and playing an exhibition with a young man who was 17 years old, and they played an exhibition on a golf course in a little town called Yas, Y-A-S-S, in New South Wales, Sand Greens, and the young boy that he played that exhibition with was me. Yep. So uh what am I? I'm 84 minus 17. Is that 67 years ago?

SPEAKER_03 25:14

Yeah, can you believe that?

Bruce Devlin 25:16

Oh man, what an unbelievable to think that you go back that far. And uh I tell you, you know, Gary just just lost his lovely wife, Vivian, here a few months back, and he's uh he's got a fantastic view on life, you know. Uh he said he had, you know, 60 odd of the greatest years he ever had with a woman that he loved and his closest friend. And uh, you know, uh as hard as it may be, he's you know, he's ready to live the rest of his life. And and he still can laugh, and uh he's a he's a fun guy to be around.

Mike Gonzalez 25:56

Wouldn't you just love to be able to take that enthusiasm he has for life, bottle bottle it up, put it in pill format, and just take one every morning.

Bruce Devlin 26:04

And sell it, yeah. And sell it too.

Mike Gonzalez 26:08

Oh man, I guess. Yeah. Of course, we talked to Jack Nicholas, and uh Jack was in that familiar office uh office setting in his home that uh you may see in other interviews, and uh uh had a nice time reflecting on a whole host of things, some of it being the charities he's involved in. Of course, he did talk about uh some of the early days in traveling again uh to Australia, where uh oftentimes uh uh under the management of Mark McCormick, you and and Jack and Arnie and Gary Plair were featured around the world in a series of exhibitions, weren't you?

Bruce Devlin 26:43

That's true, yeah, that's true. And we we recalled some of the crazy things that we did back then, too.

Mike Gonzalez 26:49

Uh like throwing the pizzas out the window if they listen steak.

Bruce Devlin 26:54

Well, not pizzas, it was a steak.

SPEAKER_04 26:56

Sorry. I was thinking Frisbee was immediately Yeah.

Bruce Devlin 27:02

No, yeah, that was sort of a that was a that was a funny evening at the Chevron Hotel in Melbourne, Victoria. Uh but uh yeah, he's been a great friend as uh you know and I s I started my relationship with Jack a long, long way back back in uh in 1960 when I was selected for the second time to to go play in the Eisenhower Cup matches at Merion. Uh I ended up going to to uh Nicholas's house, or his family's house actually, in Columbus, and practiced with him and stood on the practice tee with him and Jack Groudy's great coach. And then we went and played the uh U.S. Amateur in St. Louis that uh that actually Dean Beaman ended up winning the winning the amateur that year. But uh Jack and I have been close friends for a long, long time, and uh he and Barbara are just two of the finest people you'd ever want to meet.

Mike Gonzalez 28:00

You know, a couple of the interviews uh that stand out to me um are with guys that uh and a lot of these guys were like this, Bruce, but uh I found guys like Charlie Cootie, we talked to Charlie about uh his master's win 50 years ago, and uh Bill Rogers, we talked about his win at Royal St. George's in the Open Championship. I think that was uh 40 years ago in 1981, maybe. Um I just found them to be uh down-to-earth, humble, very unassuming guys, and it was just a delight to talk to them.

Bruce Devlin 28:38

Yeah, that you know, and you can you can go through a lot of the other names too. Uh, you know, we we think about Andy North, you know, uh r recalling the uh second open victory that he had, you know, trying trying to make a bogey on the last hole to win, you know. I mean, it it's that's it's quite remarkable, really, when you think about it. Michael Kovecki winning the open.

Mike Gonzalez 29:02

Yeah, it was kind of neat to hear hear you talk about playing with uh a very, very young Jerry Pate at Atlanta Athletic Club. Uh the first two rounds, you and Charlie Cootie, and he was quite quite grateful to the two of you for being so kind to a young guy who had just won the U.S. amateur the year before, and uh he ends up winning the U.S. Open.

Bruce Devlin 29:31

Yeah, well, you know, he paid us, he paid Charlie Cootie and I a great compliment, and uh uh and he remembers that. Now I remember something that happened that that second day. We were we get to the 15th hole, the great par three there at the Atlanta Athletic Club, and I mean it's a miserable par three, water on the right hand side, bunkers left, and uh I guess I had the I had the honor and the T and I hit it in the left bunker, and Charlie Cootie hit it in the left bunker, and I'm uh standing back there watching Pate and I'm wondering what he's gonna do. You know, he's a young, you know, damn near a rookie on the tour, and he stands up there with the two iron and started it right at the flag, and it stayed right on the flag. He hit it about five feet, made a two. And I thought, man, this guy, this guy could really play. Well, he sure did. He won he won the open that weekend with that fabulous shot that he hit on the second shot on the eighteenth hole out of the right rough with a five-on. What a shot.

Mike Gonzalez 30:32

Yeah, yeah. You know, we've talked to well, we've talked to probably guys that have uh won at least a dozen of each of the four major championships. We went through some of the stats earlier, but uh, you know, we just talked to Marco Mira and and uh he had two uh major championship wins uh after the age of 42 or three, didn't he?

Bruce Devlin 30:54

Yeah, which was which is quite remarkable. And then you know, then we can we had uh we had Larry Myers, you know, re recalling what happened at a at Augusta when he when he chipped in on Norman. Uh yeah, there's a lot of uh Nick Price.

Mike Gonzalez 31:12

Nick Price, what a what a great champion. I tell you, what a fun guy he was to watch swing the golf club. Holy smokes! See, there was a period of time, Bruce, as you know, probably the hottest guy on the planet, and man, he was dialed in.

Bruce Devlin 31:25

Yeah, he could he was he was very tough to beat there for a couple of years. I mean, he just about won just about everything he played in. And then we have uh we have our Canadian Mike Weir, who recalls his victory, too. So, you know, it's been a it's been terrific.

Mike Gonzalez 31:43

Yeah, you're you know, we talked to your old buddy Tony Jacklin, who was involved in a lot of great golf history. Uh, you know, won the won the open championship, I think, in 69, was it at Litham? Um, and then uh in 1970 uh comes across and wins the the U.S. Open Hazel team.

Bruce Devlin 32:01

Yeah, the uh on uh on uh on the cow pasture. We've heard some Dave Hill stories, haven't we? Huh? Uh have we heard some Dave Hill stories? Yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 32:15

And what about Hale, what about Hale Irwin? Three U.S. opens, uh uh and uh I don't know, how many wins does he have on the senior circuit now? Uh record setter?

Bruce Devlin 32:26

Forty forty-five, I think. Forty-six, maybe. Yeah, that's and I think uh I think a guy that ultimately we'll talk to, Bernhard Langer, uh he may he may actually break Irwin's record of wins on the uh on the on the champions tour, but uh what what a career Irwin had, you know. I mean, and you talk about a center focused guy. I mean, he he got into a dream when he was playing. Just complete control, like a lot like Nicholas in lots of ways.

Mike Gonzalez 33:03

And Bruce, you know, I know we sure enjoyed hearing from Dave Stockton him talking about his two PGA wins, but wasn't it the delight to hear some of the stories coming out of that 1991 Ryder Cup victory where he was a captain and his sons were his co-captains?

Bruce Devlin 33:18

Yeah, it was very interesting, wasn't it? And you know, I I remember back uh playing a lot of golf with Dave Stockton. I always considered him one of the greatest putters that ever played the game. And of course, he's uh he's responsible for a lot of the guys on the tour today uh changing their putting method. So uh yeah, he had a couple of PGA victories for him and then the Ryder Cup issue. Uh it was fun talking with David. He's uh he's been a good player and uh and has been great for the game of golf, really.

Mike Gonzalez 33:49

It was a fun visit, and I told both he and Hal Sutton, I think we even put it in our episode notes, I think uh if you look at the complete body of work of those two players between the majors, TPC wins in case of uh in case of uh how you look at uh the amateur careers, but also you look at the post-career, particularly with uh with Dave and what he's done with teaching the game of golf. I think that both both bodies of work are worthy of Hall of Fame consideration.

Bruce Devlin 34:18

There's no doubt about it. I I agree with that wholeheartedly.

Mike Gonzalez 34:22

I guess uh Bruce, one thing that uh I don't know, I I I guess I've come to learn is uh a bit more about the mindset of these champions. Um all competitive, most with a killer instinct, but there was that sort of mentality that that's present in all of these guys that uh uh perhaps you don't see with uh oh, I don't know, uh uh the typical, let's just say, journeyman uh tour player, uh these guys had a champion's mentality.

Bruce Devlin 34:57

Yeah, I think uh I I see it in quite a lot of them, uh and in particular with Jack. Uh you could if you're paired with Jack and once once you hit your T shot and you walk down the fairway and you could talk about any subject with him, and then about when he was about 15 yards short of his golf ball, it was like uh uh tune out, uh you know, there's a game at hand, and uh he just went into his little uh cocoon and and worked out what he wanted to do with the golf shot, and and obviously uh did exactly what he wanted to do a lot of times. But uh I I see I saw that in a in a lot of the guys as well.

Mike Gonzalez 35:41

I think uh one of my favorite interviews that we've had thus far was with Tom Watson. And uh with Tom we told his early story, which will be our episode 100 that our listeners will have just listened to, but then we just focused on his five open championship wins because uh some people may remember, but we released that episode to coincide with Open Championship Week back in July. And to hear those stories, not not just the stories of success, but he had a very particular story about a big failure that everybody remembers as well. I it maybe it's it maybe failure's not the right word, but certainly a large, large disappointment.

Bruce Devlin 36:29

Yeah, well, he uh he's well, you know, what a record. What a record he's had at the open. Uh and in the early days he you know, he said he was befuddled actually playing on uh on the European or the you know the Scottish type golf courses, but boy did he learn how to play them. Uh some some fabulous victories. Uh I think I think the one that I remember the most is uh he and Jack being paired the last two days together, and and boy, you talk about a shot-for-shot uh dog fight, that was it.

Mike Gonzalez 37:09

That was an exhibition of golf. And then, of course, uh we just sort of alluded to the the uh the the very, very, very difficult uh loss that he experienced as a 59-year-old. It's just hard to believe at Turnberry against Stuart Sink.

Bruce Devlin 37:24

Yeah, and he you know he's he's very open about the fact that that uh you know if sort of like what Hogan said, you know, you you see the ball going through the air and you try to repeat what you've got in your mind, and and he he did exactly that. He said that he hit the most perfect eight-iron second shot that he could hit. And unfortunately it sort of caught a little downslope in the green and it sort of kicked forward a little bit more than probably it normally would. Carry the ball another yard or be another yard short, he probably wins the open. But you know, one never knows what's gonna happen, do you? Then he fails to get it up and down, and then Stuart beats him in a in a four-hole playoff. So it was uh it was a very, very tough loss. But, you know, he's he's uh he's okay about talking about it too, you know. He'll tell you there was a great disappointment, but what a what a chance to win the open at 59. Boy.

Mike Gonzalez 38:28

Maybe my favorite part of the interview with Tom is finding uh or discovering what a good impersonator he is, particularly he does a really good Jack Nicholas.

Bruce Devlin 38:40

Yeah. Yeah, he's he he's a very talented uh boy, you know, and and and there there was a time when when Mr. Watson was struggling with himself too, you know. Uh and he uh he was strong enough to to get over that problem and become one of the great players that ever played the game.

Mike Gonzalez 39:03

As you look across some of the guys we've talked to, uh when it comes to closing golf tournaments, were there any guys more so than Lanny Watkins and Hal Sutton that like to keep their foot on the gas?

Bruce Devlin 39:21

I don't think so. Uh uh I think uh I think you probably nailed that well, maybe Curtis. Curtis is uh, you know, and uh of course you start going through them, then you talk about that. Do you leave Jack out of it? You know, it's hard to leave him out of it. Sure. No, there's a lot of closers in it. Or yeah, the I mean you talk about closers, tough guys to play against. My goodness.

Mike Gonzalez 39:49

Uh we had the opportunity to visit with uh another fellow Aussie, Ian Baker Finch, a couple of times. Of course, Open Championship winner from uh from Burkdale. Uh he recounted the story of his first uh British Open he played in and got a little help from some of his countrymen learning the golf course, as I remember as a young man.

Bruce Devlin 40:09

Yeah, and and then he also talked about uh after winning, uh standing on the first T and hitting the most unbelievable shot that I think has ever been hit off that first T when he hit it out of bounds over by Rusak's Hotel. Uh so you know the guys have been they've been very forthcoming about and I think I said it earlier about the great things that's have happened to him on the golf course and some of the things that have really been tough for them. So it's uh it's been fun chatting with them.

Mike Gonzalez 40:44

Yeah, it really has. I hope we didn't leave anybody out, but I think we had a nice recap of uh most of our talks with these guys. But as we said earlier, we've we've recounted the stories uh of a lot of key golf events in the past uh 60, 70 years, major championships and uh and TPC championships and the like.

Bruce Devlin 41:06

Well, uh the and another story that that that reminded me too is is Fuzzy. Fuzzy and Norman when when Fuzzy pulled the uh the White Towel Act. And and we've uh we're gonna get to talk to Fuzzy again, too. He uh, you know, we didn't uh we were a little bit restricted on time when we first talked to him, and uh and I uh unfortunately he also lost his darling wife too this year. So uh we'll get back with Fuzzy and we'll talk some more about his great accomplishments in this wonderful game.

Mike Gonzalez 41:46

So uh looking forward, Bruce, I guess you know the question for both of us is having done this now for about eight months or so, uh, which is a fairly short time, uh, but we've done a lot. So what's next? And uh uh I think uh one of the things is just looking forward, you know, what are we trying to do in terms of the kind of future guests we want to get? What would we like to have uh accomplished when all said and done?

Bruce Devlin 42:14

Well, you know, we've got uh I I think it would be great if we could get to all of the all of the male world golf hall of famers that are still around today. It'd be great to talk to all of them, you know. Uh also anybody that's won a major, uh, you know, we're trying to trying to we're well Bob Charles, for instance, who lives still lives in New Zealand. Uh we're gonna get try to get with him that apart of uh February and talk about his open victory in 1963. So uh that'd be uh that'd be great. And the other thing, and I I think you've you've always wanted to do this is talk to other people that that are the great influences of this great game of golf and and uh the significance of their contribution to the game as well, not just only the uh the pros and who who get the checks and all the rest of it, but the guys that uh have had great influence on this great game.

Mike Gonzalez 43:18

So we have uh a lot of stuff in the can, and uh uh and so for example, we've just recently talked to three guys that uh we haven't even released their part one episode yet, Bruce.

Bruce Devlin 43:32

Yeah, that's uh Larry Myers, obviously. We we talked about him winning the uh masters, and then uh Mark Kalkavecchia, who won the open, and then uh John Mahathia, uh PGA champion. So uh we gotta get a chance to talk to them, and I'm sure we'll hear some great stories from all three of 'em.

Mike Gonzalez 43:54

Well, I I I I know we will, uh having already edited part one, the of uh all of those all of those episodes, but we're probably going to have two or three episodes from each of those three guests. And then you had listed uh the up and comers um earlier. You talked about some of our upcoming guests and all of them major championship winners. I think of the nine guys you listed, uh at least four of those are Hall of Famers. And uh so you talk about wanting to talk about all the living to all the living golf Hall of Famers. Well we're sure getting through the list aren't we?

Bruce Devlin 44:30

Yeah we certainly are and uh uh I uh you know I I don't know what more you can say about how how how great these guys have been to the both of us uh you know you mentioning about you know sometimes an hour you talk with the guys trying to get everything ready to do the podcast they've uh they've been they've been fantastic and uh you know quick run up upcoming guys Bobby Nichols Lee Jansen Steve Stricker Craig Stadler Davis Love uh Johnny Miller Lou Graham Bob Charles and the elusive Mr.

Mike Gonzalez 45:09

Trevino so let's let's go through this we've got uh one two three four five six seven eight nine we've got fifteen majors in that group of the nine guys you just mentioned that's pretty good huh yeah yeah people remember Bobby Nichols he won the 64 PGA but uh uh you may remember him for one of the guys that uh got hurt uh uh by lightning at the 1975 Western Open where and you were there because that was Trevino Jerry Heard and and I was standing on the 14th T and I watched the lightning strike and I watched these guys and this the young boy that had the uh you know the the banner with the scores on it and the lady marker uh it was a it was a very very scary time and fortunately we didn't lose anybody but I think all of them had back problems ever since where were those guys standing Bruce were they on that par 313th green is that where they were when you were up on 14 T no they were standing they were in the fairway about to hit their second shot on 14 yeah gotcha gotcha of course we talked about Lee Jansen Lee was the winner of the U.S. Open in 1993 1998 Steve Stricker just finished his Ryder Cup stint and uh fine victory up at Whistling Straits. Craig Stadler the winner of the 1982 Masters of course we'll talk to Hall of Famer Davis Love who won the PG8 wingfoot in 1997. Johnny Miller also a Hall of Famer famously uh scored that 63 in the final round of the U.S. Open at Oakmont 1973 and then also won the the open championship at Berkdale in 1976. Lou Graham who I remember watching this one Bruce I was there at Medina in 1975 when he won the U.S. Open and one of the things I remember and I I haven't been able to find it but I know it's in my uh scrapbook somewhere but the U.S. Open ticket the you know the sort of the daily badge was on a it was a paper thing or you know light cardboard paper thing on a string as most of them were that you put on your belt loop but it was in the shape of a star. I don't know if you remember that but Texaco must have been one of the sponsors and the ticket was actually in the shape of a star. Yeah uh but that was in 1975 and that came right after the lightning event at uh at the Western Open that year didn't it?

Bruce Devlin 47:46

Yes it did. That's right. Yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 47:49

And then uh you mentioned Bob Charles who won at Lithum I think in 63. I think Jacqueline was the next person to win there in 69 and then of course Lee Trevino Hall of Famer with uh the winner of six majors. So the thing to remember for our listeners is we haven't told the complete stories of too many of our guests. In other words of the 30 guys we've talked to we've only told the full story of a handful of them and for most of those guys we've got parts two three four actually coming don't we?

Bruce Devlin 48:21

Yes we do and uh you know um we've always you and I have talked a lot about uh maybe sponsorship of the podcast and stuff like that and you and I have come to uh come to an agreement haven't we and you might want to tell the folks exactly what we're planning to do.

Mike Gonzalez 48:44

Well yeah as you mentioned uh I think we approached a couple of people before we got started and and I don't blame them for not signing up with us because they didn't know what they'd how we might do with this. But now I think we're past the point where we have any interest in sponsorship. Just to be clear to our listeners, uh Bruce and I aren't doing this to make money. We don't take a nickel for any of this stuff. Matter of fact we don't bring in a nickel for any of this stuff. It's a I look upon it as a as a mildly expensive hobby at this point. But what I think our vision is is that we realize now we are creating a nice repository of golf history stories of these great players of yesteryear and we want to make sure we find a good home or find someone that can archive this repository of interviews for future generations. So we would hope that in 50 years a hundred years people want to know who Tony Jaclyn is or Bruce Devlin or Gary Player or something we can do our little part in helping tell their story in their words. And so Bruce we've had some discussions and uh are hopeful that uh one of the major golf organizations might uh might take this on with us.

Bruce Devlin 50:04

Yeah well we you know we look at the World Golf Hall of Fame and the USGA the PGA tour the RNA and and of course the PGA of America you and I both think that this stuff should be archived you know 30 40 years from now when some young player comes up and he hears a story about Jack Nicholas or Lee Travino it'd be great to be able to press a button and listen to their story.

Mike Gonzalez 50:33

I think one of the things I'll I'll mention Bruce and it's something again we've talked about we have captured video for just about every one of our guests except those early interviews I mentioned that we did in person. And so we do have that material available and how we're going to use it uh is to be determined but uh I think we have an opportunity at a minimum to use a YouTube channel that we've created and actually repurpose these short tracks, these short highlight excerpt tracks and produce videos from them and release those on YouTube just as another way for our listeners to sort of engage with these stars of yesteryear, actually see uh the people we're talking to and and bring them to life a little bit. So perhaps the next thing to look forward to for our listeners might be that you'll start seeing us pop up with these uh short track videos on YouTube.

Bruce Devlin 51:27

And we'll we'll obviously uh make sure all the players give us you know give us the ability for us to do that uh we'll have to we'll have to go back to them all and say what we'd like to do but I got a sneaking suspicion that they'll be okay with it.

Mike Gonzalez 51:47

I do too I do too. Well anyway um I think that uh does a nice job Bruce of telling the story of our first hundred episodes and gives our listeners a little bit of an insight into what we see going forward. I didn't bring uh uh a glass of wine or a glass of champagne or anything to toast you but uh here's to the next 100 partner.

Bruce Devlin 52:12

Yeah yeah I got one here too and uh I it's been it's been a fun journey and uh we look we look certainly look forward to uh chatting with the rest of these great players and uh I'd just like to remind everybody that's listened to our podcast tell all your friends you know let's let's go from 58 countries to 158 countries and from 2700 cities to 27000 cities that would be fun and uh you and I'd look forward to that wouldn't we mike we sure would and uh as you say if uh you've got somebody or even yourself that listens but hasn't subscribed or followed make sure you follow us on the podcast platform of your choice for the good of the game thanks for joining us Bruce I look forward to the next 100 then it started me too just we we been thank you for listening to another episode of For the Good of the Game and please wherever you listen to your podcast on Apple and Spotify if you like what you hear please subscribe spread the word and tell your friends until we tee it up again for the good of the game so long everybody it went smack down fair way it's let's just make a flat as long as you're still in the stage you're okay when it's mid down the middle