Sir Bob Charles - Part 1 (The Early Years)

Mike Gonzalez 0:16

Welcome to another edition of FORE the Good of the Game and Bruce Devlin. Today we have our second left-handed golfer that's been on the show. But I think he also gets the prize for traveling the furthest distance to join us today.

Bruce Devlin 0:32

There's no doubt about that, and what a what a great friend he's been for the last 50 odd years. I think the first time I ever met this gentleman was in 1959 in Johannesburg, South Africa. He and I were over there for the Commonwealth Games, him representing New Zealand and we Australia, and of course, anybody that knows a little bit about golf knows who it is, and it is, in fact, Sir Robert Charles. Bob, thanks for joining us today, buddy. It's really nice to have you with us.

Mike Gonzalez 1:06

Well, it's a pleasure and nice to chat with you all u welcome to the show. And uh just so you know, you are now our thirteenth Golf Hall of Famer that's joined for the good of the game on our podcast, and uh it is a delight and a privilege to have you. Uh as we've talked about before, we're here to tell your story, uh, and there's a lot to tell because you've got a uh a uh very accomplished uh uh list of of things that you've been able to do in the game of golf. And I think we always like to start just as a young guy growing up in New Zealand. So maybe you can tell us about uh what life was like as a young lad uh growing up in Carterton, New Zealand.

Bob Charles 1:48

Well, I uh never grew up in Carterton. I just happened to be born there. Uh that was the the nearest hospital uh where my mother could uh uh go to and get attended to from my birth was in Carterton. My my dad was a country schoolmaster and he was uh well at the time my birth he he was in a place called Hinakura, which was uh oh I suppose about twenty miles from uh Carterton. And uh uh so yes, Carterton was uh the place of my birth, but uh at that time my parents were living in uh a country town of Hinakura, which is about uh twelve miles uh east of Martinborough, which is uh well Martinborough is only a small small town in the Wyarappa province of uh of the North Island of New Zealand. Well actually it's in the Wellington province. Wireapa's uh a in a valley uh and uh so my uh well earliest recollections I suppose would be uh probably at the age of um three, I think. In fact, I was uh in Martinborough from the age of uh well from birth to the age of four. Uh my uh first recollection, although I don't remember too much about the age of three, is that uh I was playing outside under some trees near the house where we were living in, and I got attacked by a magpie. Uh obviously the magpie was protecting its young, and uh so I was a good uh getting a bit too close to the young, and uh so anyway I I was able to walk walk back into the house with blood streaming all over my head. Of course, I I I vague uh d I hardly remember it, but um I have an aversion to magpies ever since. I know they're they're they're very common, prevalent in in Australia, in Australia and New Zealand. So I've got them a few of them on my farm, which I take pot shots of uh with a uh uh a slug gun occasionally. So uh anyway, that's uh my first recollections, and at the age of four we um moved into the uh Martinborough, which in modern day is is very big in the the grape industry, gr growing grape and uh New Zealand wine industry. So my um I uh started school at at the age of four, uh only because my birthday is of course is in March. So school starts in February, so I was uh started uh as a uh four-year-old a month before my uh fifth birthday. And who would be my first teacher ever was my dad. Uh another not necessarily a country school but it was uh a a a small school about five miles south of Mountainborough. And uh I got uh I was there for uh probably a year during the war years. Of course, now we're talking about 1940, 1941, and uh the the little story I tell there is that um in the war years everybody was digging air raid shelters. We were we were kind of in the firing line of Japan. We we had uh uh Japanese submarines uh in well in the both in the area of Australia and New Zealand. New Zealand, I think they did fire a salvo out of from a submarine into Sydney and Australia, but uh New Zealand didn't get attacked in any shape or form. But we did everybody everybody's home had they dug an air raid shelter which was pretty basic and you know a few groceries in and uh not very deep. I don't think it could have withstood uh uh even a hand grenade, let alone a bomb. But uh the air raid at the school I was going to, Perronoa, um uh it was uh they had two air raid shelters, and uh uh the instructions from the headmaster, my dad, was you cannot walk on top of the air raid. They were covered actually, you could not walk on the top of the air raid shelters. And on one frosty winter morning, my dad looked out the window, saw um saw uh three or four boys walking across the um air raid shelters. So uh we were back in and I don't know whether we got six of the best. My dad was a was a very uh disciplinarian and um uh he used a razor strop. I don't know you you uh Mike probably wouldn't be aware of what a razor strop is. I don't I don't have them actually. No, yes. Uh so uh I don't know whether it was six of the best or just a gentle tap or what, but uh uh I re I remember that at the uh at the first uh uh school I went to. And uh then I attended when my dad actually had was called up into the services, well uh yeah, volunteer called up, I'm not sure which, uh, into the army. Uh in 41, uh he uh um well was not teaching anymore, so I started going to the Martinborough School, which was within walking distance of where I was living at the time, and so uh dressed up in my Harris tweed jacket and my hot nailed boots, I walked to school uh every day. And in the primers, as they were called, from uh well, five-year-old starting school. And uh of course the uh my dad went away to uh well he started out in the army, was about to be drafted well no his company or battalion, whatever, was about to leave for um the Middle East and um so uh the the house which we were renting, uh my mother decided that she would uh become a caretaker for an elderly gentleman in Martinborough who happened to be the um news uh tobacco and newsstand uh it was as it was called. Uh they had a billiard table, uh he uh had a hair salon, uh we cut hair and uh sold the usual knickknacks uh in his in his store. We uh accommodated upstairs, so I spent uh probably four years, three or four years I suppose during the war. And those were probably uh one of the happiest years of my life. Uh it things were very quiet. Uh of course the the adults wouldn't have said that the uh because we were living on coupons. You had coupons to have butter and coupons for sugar and coupons for meat. And it was uh frugal times, which which I lived through, which uh I I think was uh had some bearing on my uh upbringing to be um you know, be careful. Conservative spending spending money. Um but of course I had a um a driveway down the side of the house which I used as a as a a cricket uh I could bowl the cricket ball twenty-two yards, and um I had uh uh well the other thing I was an only child, so uh I didn't uh uh I I guess I was it was spoiled in some respect, although I was certainly disciplined uh with the uh spare the rod and spoil the child. Uh they did my folks didn't they they didn't spare the rod. So I I was uh no an only child, but I I was in in many ways uh spoilt, I suppose. I've always had uh my first recollection of a a I think it was a a birthday gift or a Christmas gift was a rugby football. And that was the uh uh I was able to kick the kick the football in a in a paddock next to the house, and that that was a lot of fun. Uh but during those that period I acquired an interest in in ball games. I I played uh tennis on grass tennis courts. Um I'm talking between the ages of five to eleven, which I was spending uh in Martinborough, so that's from what 41 to uh 47, 1941. And uh I I had uh two uh uh old hickory-shafted uh clubs, uh Mashey and a Mid Iron, and I was uh had a paddock nearby where I was able to go out and and hit the the first two clubs I ever owned uh were Hickory. Uh so I was uh couldn't have been happier with the uh opportunity to to play tennis, play cricket, and and hit golf balls. Uh my rugby uh came to an end, I suppose, in uh uh at the age of twelve when I had a a serious injury uh where I tore all the well, I was tackled with the ball carrying the football and went down and my legs uh spread and and I tore all the muscles uh in my in my groin. Worst part of that was that uh I was virtually an invalid for three months, could barely walk, and uh I missed uh most of the cricket season. So that was the end of rugby, and so right after um this injury I concentrated on golf in the winter. Golf, as you you may not be aware, is a winter sport uh here. Well, I think in Australia and New Zealand. Correct. Uh and cricket cricket was my summer sport, and uh golf was uh was my winter sport. So that was the uh I'm taking you from the age of five through to um uh ten. Um the um I I I didn't want for anything, I was reason re reasonably warmly dressed in the winter, and uh although things were hard to get, the old O'Brien hobnailed boots, they were they were made to last, they were a daily you gotta round in and uh and hobnailed boots. Well, you know, what you think about it today, you wonder what why that why would you ever do that? But that was the fashion in the day.

Bruce Devlin 13:11

So Bob uh getting to the golf side of uh of uh your career, you uh w we understand that you never ever had a lesson from a pro. So who started you in the game? Who got you who really piqued your interest?

Bob Charles 13:30

Well, you you might say that uh the first golf course uh I was wheeled around in a pram, perambulated as they call in America. I'm I'm not sure. But uh whilst they were living, my folks were uh well, I'm only what well a baby at um at in Hinakura, uh shortly after I was born, um uh we had well the the local farmers put together a nine-hole golf course uh virtually right beside the house we were living in, and uh my mother and uh one of the farmers' wives had a baby, um same age. So uh I was pushed around this nine-hole golf course. I suppose uh I don't well I wasn't breaking teeth at that stage, but there were golf balls would have been in the Pram and golf clubs would have been across the Pram. And uh so that was my I didn't know it of course, but that was my introduction to golf. So anyway, my parents were both keen golfers. Um they um my mother started out as a right-handed golfer, and um my dad was naturally a left-handed golfer, obviously like myself, and uh they uh when they moved into Martinborough, they joined the Martin Borough Golf Club, and also they've been members of golf well, members of golf clubs right from uh day one as far as uh I was concerned. So uh both my mother and father were very keen sportsmen. They love their ball games, uh they love their tennis. Mother didn't play cricket, but um she uh really enjoyed her golf and and um she got down to a single-figure handicap. I think eight was the lowest she got down to, and my dad got down to a uh I think about a two handicap. So they were they were pretty useful golfers, and uh I guess they gave me uh an introduction to the game and also to other ball games as well. And of course, my um I at my happiest when I'm competing uh in a b with a ball game on my farm out uh here in well I'm fifty actually fifty miles from my farm right now, uh at in near Oxford and in New Zealand. I have a croakie court, I have a tennis court, I have a billiard table and a ping pong table, and uh I'm at my happiest when I'm c playing or competing in in any one of those sports.

Bruce Devlin 16:15

That was why he was tough on the golf course, Mike. Did you get that did you get that message why he was so tough on the golf course?

Mike Gonzalez 16:25

Yeah, and as you know, uh many of our guests uh have talked about the same thing, being multi-sport athletes, uh ball games, developing hand-eye coordination at a very young age.

Bob Charles 16:39

Yeah, well, you could call me a ball freak uh if if if you like. Um I uh uh obviously inherited it from my parents. And my my dad retired after 40 years in the pr teaching profession. They uh my my folks spent uh most of their lives um renting, renting houses. My dad and I was in a profession where he could be moved around the country uh as as a t teacher, and uh so it wasn't until he retired well at the age of fifty-eight, he started teaching when he was eighteen, and retired forty years later when he was fifty-eight, and uh they built their first house, which my dad had saved enough money to be able to um build a house in his retirement, which happened to be within walking distance of the Christchurch Golf Club, where we as a family all came to in 1956, and I, of course, was a 20-year-old then, joined the mu the Christchurch Golf Club, and uh so both my parents spent uh a lot of the time, their retirement years, on the Christchurch Golf Club um uh playing this great game of golf.

Bruce Devlin 17:57

So, Bob, the other the other difference between uh you growing up in uh in New Zealand is the fact that you didn't get the uh the intense golf uh through a university uh like a lot of the Americans have. You you went into the banking business, right? You were a teller at your young age.

Bob Charles 18:19

Well, yes, I um and the only reason I got into the bank w when I finished high school, it took me five years to get through high school. I I spent an extra year to get a school certificate. Um I I was uh not a a good student. I was a very poor student. I um I didn't believe in homework. I I I doubt whether I spent more than a couple of hours of homework. And this is, you know, the son of a school teacher, uh and my dad didn't actually believe in homework anyway. He the teaching he taught uh in school during what between nine and three o'clock, and when that three o'clock bell went, not only did the kids out there on the playing fields, but my dad was out there with them at coaching them in rugby and teaching them cricket and that. Uh he did not believe in homework, and and I uh spent um, well, obviously you've got to put a little bit of time in, uh, which I didn't, and all I was interested in was getting out on the golf course and or the playing fields. So uh my education was somewhat neglected, and uh so um but the age of 17 uh coming up on 18, I uh had no idea what the future held for me. I had no ambitions whatsoever, no job prospects. I was had well I wasn't uh didn't have the the uh exam marks or to go to university. You you had to have a certain level of education to get into that. So uh I just happened to be at the at the as I say at the age of late 17. Uh I happened to be playing around a golf with the local bank manager of the national bank, his name was Ron Straun. And uh I guess it came up in conversation as to what I was gonna do leaving leaving school, leaving well high school. And uh he said, Well, why don't why don't I give you a job as a junior in the bank? And uh so I said, Well, it's one way of earning money, I suppose. And uh and the the other great thing about uh in the bank, in those days they the doors closed at three o'clock, uh, as did school. And uh as long as you'd balance the books, uh I could be on the golf course by four o'clock.

Bruce Devlin 20:49

Perfect.

Bob Charles 20:51

Every in the summertime uh I spent hours and hours on the golf course. So it the seven years I spent in the bank were uh well, they were very pleasant years. I and enjoyed the work, um but it did give me a huge opportunity to uh develop my golfing skills after after hours uh uh at work at and so yes uh I well in fact my banking career ended when the uh well it it's uh well I I spent uh of the seven years in the bank I spent uh what was it, I think three years in Masterton, which was in the Warappa, uh where my first twenty years were uh was spent. Uh and then uh uh w my dad was moved from a Masterton school. He got a job as the headmaster at the Kashmir School here in Christchurch. And so I moved with him down here at the time and uh moved with uh with the bank. I heard a move in the bank to the National Bank of New Zealand here in uh Christchurch. Uh so I spent four years uh before I turned pro. And uh of course during those years I had the opportunity of um well my my first uh international um well leaving New Zealand was in 1956. At the age of twenty I um together with uh a golfing friend John Durry uh who was actually in the team Bruce would remember John from the New Zealand team at the Commonwealth uh golf tournament in Johannesburg we went uh well we we entered we and got uh accepted uh as entrance into a Polacco well was in Australia I'm talking about Polacco tournament in uh Sydney at the Australian golf uh uh yeah Australian golf club and the uh Ampole tournament uh in Melbourne at uh Royal no Yarriero that's Yeri sorry so that was my first trip overseas I played in the two tournaments uh I didn't make the cut in either but it was my first international experience I I watched uh Bo Weineger was playing uh George Bayer one of the longest hitters in the game at that time uh was playing from from the United States Flory Van Dog from Belgium Gary Plair Harold Henning and uh uh Trevor Wilkes were from Australia uh so I was rubbing shoulders with these well young pro well some yeah they were pretty much young pros at that time and uh so it was a great experience and of course indeed I need I say uh Gary uh won the Pampole tournament uh his first I think it was his first ever win and of course that was um he was able to go back to South Africa and um marry his childhood sweetheart right Villiam whom we just lost so I I'm a little emo uh you're I I'm a little emotional now but I'll I'll I'll get over that. Um yes so um uh that was that was my first um venture overseas to Australia for we were there for about two or three weeks I suppose just playing in two tournaments. Uh after I came back I was invited by a a golfing friend uh my name of Ian Krom uh member of the Christchurch golf club and he well yes he invited me to uh join him on a trip virtually around the world in nineteen fifty eight starting in in January of nineteen fifty eight and um uh the the trip um well in started off with what four months in the United States and about uh three months in um the UK um prior to departing on this trip uh I had written a letter to uh Clifford Roberts at at Augusta and uh put my um what do you call it your your um your C V your curriculum VT C V that's the word I'm looking for uh which uh was uh included the New Zealand Open which I had uh won four years earlier a as an am 18 year old amateur and uh in those days uh at Augusta um uh they were looking for international golfers um and uh I think they uh must have uh uh pricked their attention that um gee they never never had heard of anybody from New Zealand and and so anyway I got a lovely uh invitation from uh Clifford Roberts I've still got the letter signed by him to inviting me to the Masters in 1958 so I'm getting kind of ahead of myself I suppose in a way but uh 1958 I as I said I spent seven months out of New Zealand traveling the world living out of a suitcase I played in two major well three may some would say three majors which was the uh Masters the British Open and the British Amateur uh so it was this trip which uh set me up really for uh a future in professional golf and uh and then my next international trip was to uh South Africa in nineteen fifty nine for the Commonwealth tournament and then I also went to um Marion in nineteen uh sixty sixty wasn't it yeah nineteen sixty sixty yeah yeah when uh um Jack uh Nicholas uh did this incredible incredible scoring around round the um yeah so uh oh well that's right I'm getting back to when I turned pro. So after that uh trip and to Marion I um I came back and the bank manager said uh we want to move send you to Wellington giving me kind of a a little bit of a um what shall we say hopefully a lift in salary and uh to train me to be you know a a career in banking. And uh so I uh it it didn't take me too long to think about it which meant that um well uh I'm going to um I'm gonna be away from home going to be away from the Christchurch golf club uh sending me um so uh it was an idler situation either I I continue a future in banking or my futures in golf so uh having uh made these trip international trips and and had all the experience in playing uh against the best players in the world and the and the greatest tournaments in the world it was really a no-brainer for me to uh give it a shot and uh turn pro, which I did in uh October of 1960.

Bruce Devlin 29:01

Boy, what a great decision.

Mike Gonzalez 29:04

If I can uh let's just double back on a few things that you uh you went over uh it'd be interesting I think for our listeners to understand how your golf game developed as young men because as Bruce brought up earlier you didn't really have the benefit of a normal regular coach I don't think uh did you learn the game more from observation or from reading?

Bob Charles 29:26

Uh well combination of both I suppose um I um Ben Hogan's Power Golf was um I suppose my golfing Bible and I don't know that I actually read the whole book. All I did was look at the pictures. Uh they're of course in black and white and uh I spent well I don't know now exactly but hours uh looking in front of a mirror in my my mother's dressing in their bedroom. They had a a large mirror and I would have the book uh on on in front of me and uh I'd make kind of practice swings uh in uh in front of the mirror trying to replicate uh Hogan's uh Hogan swing so uh yeah Hogan was uh well he wasn't really a mentor but uh uh his book uh certainly uh inspired me and and his golf swing and and of course uh I even say today that he was the greatest player that ever lived and you can talk about uh Jack Nicholas and Tiger Woods but uh to me Pen Hogan was the greatest golfer that ever lived. Um and in fact and interestingly well I'm getting a way ahead now uh interestingly and I'm very sad to uh learn this morning uh that uh the Oakland Hills um yeah uh clubhouse has been burnt to the ground and and it was here at Oakland Hills in 1965 I think it was um had the pleasure of playing with Ben Hogan and witnessed the greatest greatest round of golf I've I've ever ever witnessed uh playing with Ben he um he shot sixty sixty seven or sixty eight I think it was uh he must have been in his fifties at the time uh what what what in sixty five how old was Hogan yeah that's about right he would have been in his in his fifties and I mean he just virtually had every fairway hit every green and he had well you can see me obviously he had the shakes in his hands Bruce you played with him he probably played had the shakes I did I I had about I had I think four rounds of golf with him I played with him at not shady oaks in Dallas uh but anyway uh he couldn't keep his hands still uh with the putter yeah uh with with the with a long game the hands were on the club and they didn't move but with the putter he had the shakes he never missed a putt under ten feet it's the most amazing round of golf I've ever seen and and and that's why I think he's he's the greatest uh of of them all I think he he was the most the nearest anybody came to perfecting uh a mechanical uh golf swing not that it was mechanical it was just an amazing so uh where were we yeah uh we we're talking about um you just turned pro, buddy my my getting uh uh Hogan's book uh the golf club in Marston where I was uh I lived very close to nearby and had the great opportunities of getting out on there was no professional at the Marston Golf Club I just had the opportunity of spending hours and hours on the golf course in all kinds of weather rain shine wind whatever and um yeah I didn't read much well yes and now uh you can't see but I'm in my well office library um uh my top wall can I move this maybe absolutely yeah yeah yeah yeah okay can you see can you see up uh up on the top there uh can you see the green book yep yes I've got uh from the green that says Golf World goes back to nineteen fifty four now virtually my my whole um record is in these books Golf World I've had them all bound and uh I as I say started subscribing in 1954 and so I was up to date from then of everything that happened on the US tour and uh um I knew the names of everybody of course there was very little instruction in golf world it was it started out as a very small um week it was a weekly publication and I'm very sad to it's now digital and so uh which is which is sad because uh I've got these volumes about the whole wall of of the uh golf world but um uh that also inspired me I suppose and encouraged me to um well one of these days you know I'd love to go and play um uh on the on the US tour. Yeah. So uh no uh there was no pro at at at the golf club um I in short order I suppose I became probably the best golfer in the golf in the club uh by the age of 17. Uh of course going back a step at the age of fifteen uh was the well you had to be fifteen years of age before you could join the golf club. You know I'm talking about the days of uh of young kids should be seen and not heard and um you know there was there was no great encouragement for for young golfers whatsoever. So I joined the club at the age of 15 and uh played in my first tournament at uh 16 with my mother uh mixed forcome which we got beaten in the final I played my first 72 hole uh event at the age of 17. I was down on a plus handicap at the age of 17 and and uh so I I virtually picked the game up myself. I I had no um no mentors to you know tell me to do this or that and work on the grip in the stance it it was uh uh and of course well just the the the question you asked uh about uh instruction and a professional I relate um I've had two lessons in my life from professionals I'm not sure whether I actually paid for them or not but uh the thir the first lesson was was uh was uh well into my in 1966 six years into my career I'm playing at the Beverly Country Club in Chicago uh Western Open and uh I was having a bad year in 1966 and uh missing cuts and not making much money so uh and and the my problem was my t-shots my my uh preferred draw was turning into a duck hook and was duck hooks can be rather costly and expensive as you can imagine. So I sought out uh Bob Toskey and said Bob can you can you just uh come and see me hit a few balls on the range and and uh give me a uh see if we can you know straighten out the duck hook to a slight draw. So we go down to the range and he said grab a club and I grabbed the club and as soon as I grabbed the club well not hardly grabbed the club and uh he put his hand out and he grabbed the grabbed the club and he yanked at it and it was like in a vice. I had I had this club in a vice. He said there it is he says you're gripping a club too tight and he said slap loosen up loosen up the grip and uh and right from then on um I got well certainly got rid of the duck hook and uh that helped considerably the second um lesson I got was from David Ledbetter. Uh by now um let's see 40 must have been about 48.

Bruce Devlin 38:11

I was gonna say you're getting close to being a senior with David Ledbetter.

Bob Charles 38:15

Getting getting close uh so I I had uh lost my card I was uh on the regular tour and I'd been playing the European tour I played the European tour 10 years prior to for 14 years prior to uh joining the senior tour and but during that time I had a um a a well you c could almost call it a s a second tier events in the United States and uh I was over there playing in a few of them I um uh there was only about six or eight tournaments and I happened to play in them and it was during that time I I I was having problems and I booked uh I I was living uh let's see where was I living? I don't know where I was living I wasn't living in uh Farm Beach was it uh no no no it it uh I was still on on the road doesn't matter but he was I drove up I think from somewhere in Florida to uh uh was he was it Greenleaf was he at Greenleaf in uh Orlando anyway um went into his office and uh we started talking about the game and I spent uh an hour more than an hour in his office never went outside never hit a ball we just talked about the mental side of the game and uh and lo and behold the next week I'm playing in the Tallahassee Open and who wins I I went from went from virtually an hour in his uh David Ledbetter's office to to uh a tournament and and and win it which uh so um yeah that they were both very um good lessons and uh yeah I guess it's it's a good lesson for anybody is is don't grip the club too tight. Just have it have it so that you don't destroy the feel and the other lesson is the mental side of the game is just important as the physical side.

Mike Gonzalez 40:29

That win you reference Bob I think came in 1983. I want to take you 25 years prior to that I want to take both of you back to 1958. That's when you both traveled to the old course in St. Andrews for the Eisenhower trophy. Of course uh uh the Aussies prevailed as you probably remember you both did quite well as individuals but uh what are your recollections of Bobby Jones's involvement as the honorary U.S.

Bob Charles 40:53

captain in the giving that famous speech well it was uh uh we we uh attended the um when he got the what was it the uh key to the city honor Yeah the key to the city I mean it was a very moving occasion and um I don't think there were too many dry eyes in in in the house. Well there was a obviously a lot of people and at university it was in the um I just forget the name of it but uh no it it was um the Jones of course uh we all know about uh his uh history and record and what he did at at at St Andrews um and uh he went back what uh just after the war years didn't he and uh correct uh played in played in uh in in a y uh uniform as far as to the best of my knowledge uh an army uniform. No he was he in what was he in the army I'm not sure but uh no no that was uh a great occasion and of course he was suffering immensely from his uh disability and um uh no it was uh the inaugural um Eisenhower World Team Championship. Do they still call it the Eisenhower? Yeah they do Eisenhower they they they do yeah um so from my uh personal perspective it was my second visit to St Andrews my first visit was for the British uh amateur in uh June I think it was that that same year 58 and um I had uh my first look at the old course was from a train window as uh Bobby Vive a South African and I would had travelled by train from London to St Andrews we um I think the train arrived at in the station at six o'clock and we were on the golf course by seven o'clock and we finished uh three and a half hour round from seven o'clock till ten thirty most magnificent day you could imagine nothing but blue sky no wind and uh a perfect introduction for me personally to to the old course and of course I've had a love affair for the old course ever since I think it's the greatest course at um uh in the game because it's unique with its uh seven double greens it's uh you can play it uh clockwise or anti-clockwise and uh in fact uh one of my wish lists is to play play it uh clockwise but I don't know that that's going to happen because they only allow it I think for a a matter of a couple of days a year now. So uh and I and I of course I uh got through to the quarter final uh Alan Thilwald beat I think he was the final Joe Carr won the amateur that year but I think he beat Alan Thurwell who beat me in the in the quarterfinals. So uh I I when I we got there for the Eisenhower uh later in the year, probably October was it? Yeah, I think.

Bruce Devlin 44:11

Yes it was.

Bob Charles 44:12

Uh I I was certainly very well acquainted with the old course and uh what few people will remember is that uh New Zealand was leading with one round to go. And um we uh were all excited about that. I don't know whether we had a one-two or what shot lead, but obviously the the uh uh with the three contenders were uh the UK, the USA and Australia. And uh in that final round it was uh not the easiest of quite windy, I think, and cold uh in October, obviously. And uh John Durry, uh one of the team members, took a ten on the road hole. Whereas if he'd taken, I think if he'd taken a six just a bogey, we would have won. That's right. And I I went out and had uh uh around of thirty-six no uh no no, yeah. I had no forty forty shots to the green and forty and forty puts. Forty forty for eighty. John Barry shot eighty. Uh and I think we both shot eighty. Uh and if I'd had so uh something like uh thirty-six putts, uh we would have won. Uh course one of my um uh my forty putts, my thirty thirty-eight my thirty my thirty-eighth putt was was from the road on the last hole. Uh I said a drive on the road, and I was so aggravated with my putter, I said, I don't care if you break hitting it off the car, it's a sealed road. So I took hit the putter and whacked it on the green two more putts. So that was a drive and a three putt, a power on the last hole for 80.

Mike Gonzalez 46:10

Thank you for listening to another episode of 4 The Good of the Game. And please, wherever you listen to your podcast on Apple and Spotify, if you like what you hear, please subscribe, spread the word, and tell your friends until we teat up again for the good of the game. So long everybody.