Karen Stupples - Part 1 (The Early Years)

Intro Music 0:07

Straight down the middle. It went straight down the middle. Then it started to be able to do that.

Mike Gonzalez 0:15

Welcome to another edition of FORE the Good of the Game at Bruce Devlin. Our guest today, we could call her the real deal.

Bruce Devlin 0:25

That's right. She knows quite a bit about Deal, doesn't she? Well, shot some extremely low scores when she was winning. And uh since that time, since she retired, uh she has become the voice of the LPGA, the color analyst for they've done a done a great job. Welcome, Karen Stupples. Glad to have you with us.

Karen Stupples 0:56

Thank you. Thank you, thank you. It's a pleasure to be here.

Mike Gonzalez 0:59

Karen, great to get you on the program. And uh, of course, we've had a chance to chat a a little bit, and of course, you you also know that we generally start at the beginning talking about life growing up, and of course, at the at the opening, I kind of made a little play on the Deal thing because you grew up in Deal, England.

Karen Stupples 1:17

That's right. It's uh just a small town on the southeast coast, and I think for most people listening, they'll know the that Deal is really close in proximity to Sandwich and Royal St. George's Golf course, where they've had the open championship. So um, but my my hometown Deal is uh it's a pretty little seaside town and uh one that I feel very lucky that I grew up in.

Mike Gonzalez 1:41

We're gonna talk about uh Deal and its history and the Open Championship and uh and and the area uh as we go along. But uh uh just tell us about your most vivid recollections as early as you can go back as a little girl growing up in that area.

Karen Stupples 1:59

Um I I think the the sea played a big part in my life growing up. Um it was all obviously a big factor of um life in deal. Uh it's a big it's a bit of a fish in town, so people would go out to fish. My family uh were fishermen uh from way back. Not not my you know, obviously my father was not a fisherman, but the sea has played a big part, you know, in our family history. But things that I remember, I remember walking up the hill to school. I remember my dad taking me into school and you know, mum being at home uh looking after us. She she she she basically took little jobs so that she could raise us at home. She would do it, be a cleaner in a pub, and then she would sort sort of stuff uh door stops to keep the draft out. And um, you know, just basically would look after us. She would take us swimming every Saturday morning down to uh a pool that has been converted into some houses now. But it was uh the Royal Marines were were big in deal growing up, and they had a band in the in the area, and they had a swimming pool that they used to do swimming lessons in. So we used to go to for swimming there, and so Saturdays were swimming, and then dinner at my grandmother's house, which was just around the corner from us. Uh very close family, and um we we pretty much stayed that way. But I really thoroughly enjoyed Deal, and we used to walk on the seafront often, watching the waves, go down the pier. I mean, Deal is just a really lovely town, and my sister and and and father they still live there now.

Mike Gonzalez 3:32

Uh you mentioned that uh your parents took care of us, so I we assume that you had siblings. Uh I think we knew you had one sister. Is she older or younger?

Karen Stupples 3:41

She's younger than me. She's uh a bit of a superstar, really. She's um uh she did gymnastics and dancing when she was a kid. My father tried to get her into golf, um, but I was already pretty good and she's she didn't want any part of that competition. So she did her own thing. And uh, but she became a teacher and was a really good teacher, was a deputy head at at a at a primary school, which is like an assistant principal over here.

Mike Gonzalez 4:07

Yeah.

Karen Stupples 4:07

And uh then she went and did another degree to do speech and language therapy, and uh she has an autistic son. Um so her life is a little bit of a challenge, but uh she's uh she has a really lovely heart.

Bruce Devlin 4:20

So Karen, did you did you play any other sports when you were growing up?

Karen Stupples 4:26

You know, as a kid I I did. Yeah, Bruce. I um I was very athletic. Uh when I was when I was in primary school, I went to the Downs primary school. I mentioned that I used to walk uphill to school. It was probably about a 500-yard walk up the hill. And um and in in primary school I played netball uh and I did every netball's kind of like basketball, um, but it doesn't have a have a backstop and you can't dribble, you just have to keep the ball moving by throwing. Um I was really good at that. And but also I did every single running, jumping, throwing athletic thing that you could possibly do. Uh I didn't particularly like running, but I was too stubborn and hard-headed to not do it. Like once I got going, I'm like, I've got to win. Like the competitive drive was always pretty big.

Bruce Devlin 5:15

Yeah.

Karen Stupples 5:15

And then as I got over older, I played field hockey and I really enjoyed field hockey. I was I was actually pretty good at field hockey pretty quick. Um, but the two field hockey and golf really didn't mix. Uh I started to recognize that if I had a hockey game on Saturday, my golf on Sunday would be awful. So I decided that uh I could make a living playing golf and I wasn't going to do anything playing hockey.

Mike Gonzalez 5:40

Bruce, did your hockey playing overlap with your golfing as a young boy?

Bruce Devlin 5:44

It did actually, yeah. I played field hockey as well. And uh the the one thing I the one thing I think happened to me is uh I never had a very long golf swing, and I think part of that reason was field hockey you can't take that uh stick above your shoulders. So uh I guess that's you know it's good it's good for hand-eye coordination, though. It's a great sport for that, but uh uh w I couldn't swing the club like Don January, for instance, who puts it down and you know points back down to the ground with the head of the club. Uh that that I couldn't do.

Karen Stupples 6:20

Yeah, no. And it's funny you say that because I always felt like I played my best golf uh where my swing thought was short and firm.

Bruce Devlin 6:30

Yeah, well. That's certainly a field hockey feeling.

Mike Gonzalez 6:36

Yeah. So through your conversations with some of your peers uh as you got to playing a little bit more, uh did you find it was fairly common that most of the women you competed with were also multi-sport athletes and very interested in athletics uh growing up as kids?

Karen Stupples 6:53

Um I think Yes, to a certain extent. Um it was more so that their parents play golf and they were taken to the golf club with their parents, and so was introduced to the game of golf that way. It was a very similar story with me, in that that I was already playing other sports. Um, but I asked for pocket money, and my dad said you you don't get anywhere in life without working for it. So you can either help your mother with the washing up every night or you can come and caddy for me. So naturally, I'm thinking, one time caddy's got to be better than every night washing up. So I would go along and caddy for my dad. And uh and if and I was always swishing away with the club, and my dad's like, Well, you look like you might be interested. Do you want to give this this game a go? And I said, Sure, I'd love to uh give it a go. So he said, I don't know enough about it. He had a at his best, he was a 16 handicap. But he uh said, I'll get you some lessons with the pro. So he got me in with some some lessons, but it was like a group junior lesson, so there was probably about 10 of us all lined up on the driving range, and the assistant pro would come down and you know make sure you had the right basics, grips, dance, posture, the whole thing. And after the first lesson, Dad said to me, He said, Well, now you've had your lesson, you you've got to practice it. You're never gonna get better if you don't practice. So off we went to the driving, to the big practice ground it was. It wasn't a driving range, it was a practice ground where you you hit your own balls and you had to pick them up.

Bruce Devlin 8:21

Go pick them up.

Karen Stupples 8:22

And whilst I was there hitting, there was a lady Exactly, there was a lady called Joan Piper, who was a member of the golf club. This was at Prince's, which is just down the road from Ross, just across from Royal St. George's. And um she said to my dad, Oh, we said, she said, I didn't know you had a daughter, and it looks like she could be quite good at golf. We want to get her straight into the county system so she can take advantage of coaching and competitions and things like that. And I was off and running.

Mike Gonzalez 8:52

So at what age were you when you uh when you started all this?

Karen Stupples 8:57

Eleven or twelve. It was right around my twelfth birthday. Okay, all right in this in that summer.

Mike Gonzalez 9:03

And this early golf was at Princes.

Karen Stupples 9:06

It was, yes. That's where my my father, he was an artisan member. So um th they would go and do work on the course and they'd get uh you know cheaper rates to play at certain times. And then eventually Princes got rid of their artisan membership, and so he became a full member from that point on.

Mike Gonzalez 9:24

So explain for our listeners, uh particularly the non-UK listeners, this concept of different memberships at some of these clubs.

Karen Stupples 9:35

So um some of the the more exclusive clubs, uh a lot of places that would have held the open championship have what they call artisan membership. And that is where um they they will do work on the course. Things like fill-in divots, um, just little things, not not major renovations or anything like that, but you know, little up, you know, course upkeep work, and then they can play after a certain time or before a certain time, and they have their own little club within the club, and uh they obviously they don't have to pay the full price to to play the course and as as a full membership would. So I think it's a good way for for people to to become involved in golf and to have it at an affordable price. Yeah. Um, so that's a a lot how they started.

Mike Gonzalez 10:22

Was the history of that uh uh sourcing members from people in the trades?

Karen Stupples 10:30

I think I don't know for sure. Um the only thing that I've really known much about it is that um that that it's a very well-rounded group of of people from within the community um that are obviously hard-working people that probably don't get an awful lot of time because they're too busy working hard anyway. Um but it just I think it's just a nice, nice way to do it. I think in general, golf in the UK is much more affordable than it is over here in the States. And I certainly think that had I have grown up in the States, I may not have even played golf. Um, having become from such a working class family, I'm not sure that that that would have been for me. I could have ended up playing softball or something completely different. Um, as it turned out for me, that the the clubs and the courses in my area, uh they give free memberships to juniors because they want to encourage the juniors to play. So I was able to play golf for free all my junior career.

Mike Gonzalez 11:33

Yeah, I think uh courses and clubs in the US could certainly take a lesson from these clubs in the UK, including, as you mentioned, the the more prestigious or exclusive clubs that perhaps have hosted an open championship. The access they provide to juniors and to people like in your case your father back in the day, uh exceptional relative to what you find here. Yeah.

Karen Stupples 11:57

And uh, I mean, even going back farther, uh my dad had nine uncles, obviously my great uncles, and all of them were scratch or single-figure handicaps, but they were all artisan members of Royal Sinkport's golf club in Deal. So there is a rich history of artisan membership within the family and and good golf.

Mike Gonzalez 12:16

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you mentioned Princes. Uh you mentioned Princes. We should uh uh throw this in for our listeners who don't know the history, but uh Princes Golf Club, which as Karen mentioned, is located literally right adjoining uh Royal St. George's in Sandwich, and uh it hosted the 1932 Open Championship. Gene Sarazin won that particular open championship, and then uh in World War II, as most of the land on that coast became, it became a bombing run. And so I think a lot of us would have loved to have seen the contours of that land before it was sort of bombed flat during the war.

Karen Stupples 12:57

It it's uh you could see um when you when you're playing it, how you know you could see there were you know lines you know for trenches, and you know, you could see where stuff had happened. And you know, when if you go looking like as I used to do, used to go looking for golf balls in the in the deep rough because we couldn't afford to buy new golf balls. So I would go hunting and I had two piles one pile for practice balls and one pile for playing with. And uh I used to feel like I hit the jackpot if I ever found a tight list.

Mike Gonzalez 13:29

And probably if it were back in uh Bruce's day, those two piles would be the ones that went through the steel ring, they were actually round, and the ones that didn't.

Karen Stupples 13:38

Yes, yeah. Yes. Well, and and it occasionally you'd still find a small ball.

Bruce Devlin 13:45

Yeah. Once you use those old balls, uh that was about it. You know, they they didn't stay around for very long.

Karen Stupples 13:52

Yep. That's very true.

Mike Gonzalez 13:55

So Prince is now three nines. Of course, they uh they they did some work and and really did a nice job with those three courses uh in the last few years. Was it always 27 holes, Karen, back when you were playing? Was it 27?

Karen Stupples 14:09

It was always 27. Um when I had my first lesson, we were still at the old clubhouse, which has now become a lodge, and it's the the probably the closest building to Royal St. George's. Um, but I remember starting off my my career there. Then pretty shortly, I mean, I think it was within two years, uh, they moved and built a new clubhouse right in the center of the three nines, uh, which allowed for three starting points. And it's the Himalayas, the Shaw, and the Dunes of the Three Nines. And it was perfect, really, because you could have you could play as much or as little golf as you wanted. Uh the Himalayas was a great course for that because you could go out, you could play a little loop of five holes and be right back at the clubhouse. Or you could play seven, be right back at the clubhouse, or you could play nine. You know, either either one you can you can go out and play as much or as little as the daylight had for you.

Mike Gonzalez 15:04

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Uh a little story about the the lodge at Prince's, of course, it it is a line of demarcation, I think, on one of the holes at uh at St. George's. You're actually teeing off on the right edge of that building as your aiming point over a blind hill shot. But um I can remember the last time I played at Prince's, I'm on the green that uh that the lodge overlooks. And there's a big bay window facing that green. And happened to be a wedding that day. It actually happened to be uh Robert and his family that run the place. Now it happened to be a family wedding. And um uh it seemed as though the the bridal party on the you know on the on the ladies' side were in that room dressing for the wedding, not expecting to see people outside came by. And uh I won't take it any further than that, but it was sort of an interesting view. Yeah.

Karen Stupples 15:58

It's it's an amazing, an amazing place. I just remember the big bathtubs that they used to have in there. And I remember when the weather was so bad, instead of being on the practice ground having our junior lesson, we would all go down to the there was a really long corridor at on the bottom level that we would all go down to and putt. So we would putt up and down this really long corridor and we would do putting lessons down there. It was, I mean, quite an amazing place.

Mike Gonzalez 16:25

So when did you get your first golf clubs, your own full set golf clubs?

Karen Stupples 16:31

So it's an interesting story. Um obviously we know that my parents didn't have very much, so I didn't get a full set or even a half set straight away. Every Christmas and birthday I would ask for a golf club, and so I would slowly accumulate clubs, and it took me a while before I actually got on the golf course uh to play my first nine holes of golf. Uh, you know, I would try and save up and eventually uh I got half a set and I was off and running. Uh but it took me a while to to get those. But my first club was an Aitan, and I think still to this day my favorite club is an Aitan.

Bruce Devlin 17:07

Yeah.

Karen Stupples 17:08

My first set was uh Mizuno Silver Cups, uh and the the woods were proper woods, and they had they were um they were red in colour.

Mike Gonzalez 17:17

Ah, okay. All right. Um it probably wasn't too long though before the metal woods were starting to come out, so you probably didn't play too long with the wooden clubs, did you?

Karen Stupples 17:27

No, it wasn't too long at all. Um it the all the I mean I used to try and go with the fashionable thing at the time, and you know, I think I can see why you know manufacturers pay so much for advertising and getting the players to play with the with the up-and-coming newer models, because I was I was suckered into all of that when I was playing when I was a kid too. Like I wanted the the the hot thing was the the tailor made with the gold shafts.

Mike Gonzalez 17:53

Oh yeah, the burners.

Karen Stupples 17:56

Yes, and I'm like, I desperately wanted one of those, but we couldn't afford the real deal, so I got a uh a copycat one and it it worked okay for me, but the as long as it looked like it had a gold shaft and it looked like it was the real deal, I was happy.

Mike Gonzalez 18:11

So what drew you to golf?

Karen Stupples 18:16

Oh obviously spending time with my dad was the first thing. I quite liked that, and the fact that people said I was good at it from a very young age. I like being good at stuff. I'm you know, whatever it is that I'm good at, I'm very drawn to to do that. But I also love the fact that I could do it on my own, I didn't need anybody's help with it, I could just go and hit balls on the range. Um, school was very hard for me. Um, I wasn't a particularly great student, I didn't really fit into any of the clicks. Uh I mean, girls are pretty tough as a teenager. I mean, I'm sure I'm not the first person to say that. And so fitting in at school was kind of hard anyway. I was as sporty, you know, it didn't really work with a lot of the girls. And so being friends with a lot of girls wasn't really on my bingo card. So I lost myself in the world of golf, and my friends became people at the golf course, and I enjoyed the fact that I could throw myself into my golf game and into self-improvement. Like I loved the fact that I could see a progression, like I set goals and challenges for myself to improve and to get better. And for me, it's always been about the quality of ball striking, it's always been about the shot, and I'm almost more so involved with that than I ever was about scoring. Scoring was just a side, was just a byproduct of hitting the ball well for me.

Mike Gonzalez 19:46

Although getting it into the hole is pretty important. Yeah.

Karen Stupples 19:50

Yeah, it was, and I think that was one of the things with golf that I always found immensely frustrating. Like I I could be very streaky when it came to putting. If I was on if I was if I was on a hot streak, there wasn't anybody that was gonna beat me. But if I but typically more than not, I was very average putter. And so I, you know, that's those are the results you're gonna get. Yeah. If I could have been more consistent with my putting, I may have had more wins.

Mike Gonzalez 20:16

Yeah, and I'm sure you saw that in others on the tour as well, people that were just beautiful ball strikers, uh but uh ranked in the bottom half in putting and just couldn't get it done.

Karen Stupples 20:28

I mean, obviously now self-reflection, I look back on it, putting in short game just wasn't that fun for me. Like I didn't enjoy it as much, so I didn't put the time and effort into it. As much as people would tell me, I'm as stubborn and as hard-headed as they come, and I just I wanted to do what I wanted to do, and that was hit a golf ball.

Mike Gonzalez 20:46

Yeah. Uh Bruce will know what I'm talking about here, but Bruce, I've got a feeling this may come up later in the interview. This idea about maybe spending more time with the short game and putting. Oh. Well, no, I'm gonna leave that one alone, I think. It it refers to one of the last questions we'll ask you when we're when we're finishing up, Karen. This may come back as a theme, but uh so tell us a little bit about how your game developed as a kid. Uh, you know, you you start playing, you have a handful of clubs, you're kind of out on your own, uh, then you take some group lessons. But when did you finally sort of start getting serious about really developing uh and sharpening your game?

Karen Stupples 21:26

I think probably I was around 15. And I was playing in some some junior tournaments around uh the county and outside of the county and and going to um English championships and things like that. And I started to realise that I could compete and and not just compete, but realise that there was an England team to make and there was a Great Britain team to make, and there was teams to make and bigger goals to set and and more stuff to achieve. That wasn't just with Within my little circle of Southeast Kent. So I uh put my mind to working hard to try and get in those teams. And so when I was 16, I played in the English ladies' champ English Girls Championship and got selected to play for the England junior team. That was a big, big step for me in that department. And there was always people at Princess Golf Club, the assistant pros, one uh particular pro by the name of Steve Hatton was always really supportive of me and always telling me that I had a huge amount of potential, that I could always that I was gonna be great at at golf and that I always had this within me. And I think when people tell you that at a young age, particularly when you're 15, 16, 17, when you're you know you're a little unsure of yourself even, for somebody else to tell you that you have that potential, you know, somebody that you look up to because they play professional golf, you're like, well, maybe, maybe I do have a chance at this. But all of these all of these tournaments, uh, the English ladies' championship, the English, the girls junior, the the British junior, they all had impacts on me and trying to be in those teams. And it was uh it was really good for me to be part of that because you were in the system. And uh and inevitably it helps me uh get a golf scholarship to to America uh because of the career that I had playing for England and what my handicap was. I'm very uh impulsive, and uh and so uh when I was 19, I thought I really need to make a decision on what I'm doing, you know, where I'm going, what I'm doing. Um initially I thought I might go to Loughborough to to study um something up there, and then uh but realized that my grades wasn't wasn't gonna be quite good enough. So I thought, well, maybe uh scholarship in America would be the the way to go. So I'd left it a bit late. This was in June, and I wanted to get out here in the August. So I was very fortunate that anybody had any scholarships left, and Arkansas State had one and they offered it to me. And having never been to America before, my parents put me on a plane at uh in London and I was getting off the plane in Memphis. Having never been to America before, didn't know anything about anything or American schools, or it was a it was definitely different, but a very valuable experience for me. A lot of I learned a lot about my golf at Arkansas State.

Mike Gonzalez 24:32

And as I'm sure you've learned over time, while it was a cultured shock to land in in the middle of middle of America, uh, you could probably say that about a lot of places had you landed in the United States.

Karen Stupples 24:44

Oh, yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 24:44

Yeah.

Karen Stupples 24:46

For sure. I think think the biggest thing for me was being dropped off at the dorm and and not having anything. Like I didn't have bedding, I I didn't have anything. Um so when my roommate arrived who was also on the golf team, she said to me, Oh, she said, we need to make a trip to Walmart. So off so that was it. So off we went. She drove me to Walmart and I got all the necessities. But I was very lucky to have had uh a girl called Rochelle from Missouri as my roommate because she took good care of me. Rochelle Barnett.

Mike Gonzalez 25:18

Yeah, that's great. Good. Shout out to Rochelle.

Karen Stupples 25:22

Yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 25:23

We're gonna put uh college on hold because I wanted to kind of trace back to when you were a little bit younger. When did you find your way to Royal Sinkports?

Karen Stupples 25:32

So in England you you learned to drive at 17. And getting over to Prince's was a bit of an ordeal. Um I would not obviously my dad was working, he was an he was operation, he was uh in charge of directing traffic around the port of Dover. So he would work shifts. Sometimes he could take me, sometimes he he couldn't. And so I wanted to do more than what my dad was able to do. So I would often ride my bike, I would put a few clubs in a backpack and my bag of balls, and I would ride down to Prince's golf club. Now, from my house to Prince's, you're probably talking about what is it, about a five-mile bike ride, maybe a little more than that. It's a it's a good hike on a bike. Whereas Royal Sinkport's golf club was a couple of mile, a couple of miles from my house, much easier bike ride, not not too much of an issue. It quicker to get to, didn't waste any time, uh, much more efficient in terms of daylight getting to deal than it ever was getting to Princess for me on my bike. So when I was about that age range, 15, when I was starting to get competitive, I really needed and wanted more time hitting balls than I was getting. And a lot of that was down to time constraints. So Deal very fortunately allowed me to become a member, and uh and I started practicing there at Deal because it was so much more convenient for me. And at the time it was, you know, they had a really lovely ladies section as well that was always very supportive of me, and they really kind of nurtured me along. And for me, it was Deal is Deal always seemed quite posh in that the people that were members of Deal had rolled in different circles than than I was used to to to to walking with. And by being involved with them kind of opened me up to um feeling different about myself as a person. You know, they they welcomed me and made me feel like I belonged with them. So uh you know, from a self-esteem perspective, it was really quite huge.

Bruce Devlin 27:39

Yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 27:40

So help us with the history of and and and first of all, let's clear up any confusion our listeners may have as we as we go back and forth referring to the same club and by two different names. But that's pretty common over there, isn't it, in terms of referring either to the town they're in or to the name of the proper name of the golf club. Yeah.

Karen Stupples 27:59

There's so so Deal is Royal Sinkport's and Sandwich is Royal St. George's. So there are there are a number of courses in in a town in and around the UK that that do that.

Mike Gonzalez 28:12

Yeah. Yeah. Uh Hoy Lake would be another example. Royal Liverpool. Right? Yeah, yeah. Um so who was the golf professional at Royal Sinkport's when you first started going there?

Karen Stupples 28:25

His uh name was Andrew Reynolds, and uh he's only just retired. Um, but he's uh he was a tremendous tremendous guy. Just uh a good guy who would help out at with anything, with any questions, with anything that you had. Um and hanging out in his pro shop was kind of fun too, out the back when the weather was bad.

Mike Gonzalez 28:47

So so a little dig at Andrew, because I know Andrew pretty well. He he he must be old as dirt then, right? I mean, yeah, we're going back years and years here. You're just a little girl, and he's already the the pro. But seriously, what you know all kidding aside, Andrew Reynolds. Um uh I don't know if you'd call him a golf god, but he's nearly that. He's quite highly revered in golf circles in the U.K. Everybody knows Andrew. He probably spent 45 years as the head professional at at uh Royal Sinkport's. I was privileged enough to play uh in his last match the day before he retired finally. This past fall, we were, you know, we were in the area playing golf and arranged a little match with members. And uh as always, uh he was a delight to be with for the entire day, and uh we wish him nothing but the best in his retirement. Yeah.

Karen Stupples 29:38

I know. I mean, I don't think he's gonna go far from there. I think uh he's still around the area, and which is pretty nice.

Mike Gonzalez 29:47

Well, it was nice that the members named him uh captain of the club for this year, so uh he'll spent his first uh year in retirement as the captain.

Karen Stupples 29:57

Well, and and what's also nice is that one of the is that the guy who's coming in to take over from him, Sam Smitheman, was one of Andrew's assistants. Yeah. And uh so it continues the Reynolds tradition.

Mike Gonzalez 30:09

Yeah, great story. So, in all seriousness, did he did he help you much with your game?

Karen Stupples 30:15

A little bit. Um he was never really my coach, um, but he would always give me tips and advice and on about work and where to put my effort in. And, you know, the the the nuts and bolts of becoming a good golfer, really. Um I had a number of other coaches that I would trust with my golf swing, and and and that was it really. I was already on an upward sort of spiral. I went to see Clive Tucker, who was at Mannings Heath, and he was my coach for a long time in the UK and really valued everything that he told me, but I was always coming back to work on it down in Deal.

Mike Gonzalez 30:50

Yeah, well, as good a teacher as Andrew probably was, it's all the stuff around the game that he's come to know that he can impart and share with you and his other students.

Karen Stupples 31:01

Exactly.

Mike Gonzalez 31:03

So you're off to college, you're off to college now. You've just come back from Walmart.

Karen Stupples 31:10

Yes.

Mike Gonzalez 31:10

Your arms your arms are full of life's necessities. Tell us about Yes. Tell us about your early life in America and in college.

Karen Stupples 31:20

So Arkansas State s is was a fairly small school then, and uh which I think was probably a a good thing for me uh to get to grips with a smaller school. Um I realized that America is a very, very, very big place. Um, even just getting to the stores requires a car, uh, which I didn't have. So I was always having to ask for lifts or help out with something or other. Um thing that I remember the most was the the course that we played, it was Jonesborough Country Club, and it was so tight. I mean, it was tight with pine trees. I mean, just I mean, literally, you felt like you had to go on a diet to play this golf course, and it was so skinny. So I yeah, I mean it was crazy. Um, but coming from a Lynx golf course to that, oh yeah, I mean, it was like night and day. So for the first few months, I spent all of my life in the trees because I was trying to guide it down the fairway. I was trying to be safe. I thought, what in the world have I let myself in for? Until I just got so fed up one day and so mad at myself, I just started lashing at the ball, swinging as hard as I could. And all of a sudden the ball went straight down the fairway. I was like, oh, okay. I stopped guiding it. So I learned a valuable lesson there just to go ahead and hit it. It's better to be down there a long way than and in the trees than shortening the trees.

Bruce Devlin 32:44

Yeah.

Karen Stupples 32:45

So so that was good for me. Um, I had my first experience with with working out a little bit there. I mean, I hadn't not done any training or anything beforehand, uh, but we would used to go and have to do some kind of training. I watched my first basketball game and my first baseball game there.

Bruce Devlin 33:03

Yeah.

Karen Stupples 33:04

And uh it was good. The dorms, I lived, lived in those dorms that I had great roommates. Um, did not like the the three o'clock in the morning fire alarms going off, but other than that, it was it was great.

Bruce Devlin 33:19

So, how long did you stay there at Arkansas?

Karen Stupples 33:24

Yeah, Bruce, I was there for for one year. Um, we were great. They Yeah to Florida State. Um the reason for the transfer was that I was winning tournaments fairly easily. It was a first-year program, and I really wasn't maximizing my potential. I could coast and still win tournaments, and I needed to be pushed, and I I needed more than I was getting. And um, and it really was a question of well, I'm I'd be better off being back in England or transferring because I just wasn't getting the same competition. And luckily the coaches were very on board with it, they were fabulous. They're like, we totally get it. We've been lucky to have you for a year, we want you to go and spread your wings, and you know, do you have anywhere in mind? And those days there was no transfer portal, so you had to get a release from the from the coach, which they fortunately did. Yeah, and I had a friend who went to Florida State, and I said to her, I said, I don't suppose your coach has an open open spot for somebody on the team, does she? And she says, Well, let me ask, and so and here we were. I ended up transferring to Florida State.

Mike Gonzalez 34:32

Would you say you were part of that first wave coming from Europe to to play golf in America?

Karen Stupples 34:40

I would say close. Um one of the members of Raw Sinkport's updeal uh was a lady called Helen Wadsworth, and she's probably ten. I want to say she's at least six years older than me. Five or six years older than me. And she went to Wake Forest. So she was kind of my first person that I knew had had gone out to college. Then I would say that a lot of us started to go over there. Your Janice Moodis, your your varie mackayes, your uh girl called Lisa Walton, she went to there was a number of us that that found a a spot and a home here in America. And it was literally it was the making of me as a golfer. I can't say enough about um coming over here and and what it did for me all manner of manner of ways.

Mike Gonzalez 35:31

Yeah. So your game developed quite dramatically then during your college years.

Karen Stupples 35:37

Absolutely. It was the first time that I'd not had to work and play golf and do school. Um so I was, you know, I was able to just play a lot of golf and uh attempt a bit of study. I was not very good at studying, and one of the funniest stories from my time at Florida State was uh I was having to take trigonometry as one of my classes, and I'd already had to drop it one semester, and so I'm like, I'm gonna do it again. Um this time I'm gonna get it right. So my coach says to me, says, Can you show me what you've got on your schedule for for this semester? Because I want to make sure that we're we're looking good, you know, grades-wise. So I go in and she says, You trig? You've got trig. She's like, What are you doing? I she said, I want you to drop it and pick up basketball.

Bruce Devlin 36:23

I'm like, okay.

Karen Stupples 36:26

So I did. I picked up basketball, had an instant A as opposed to a potential fail.

Mike Gonzalez 36:31

Right, yeah. Good move. That's a good move. That's a pro move there.

Karen Stupples 36:34

No kidding. It was. It was a good coach's move. Keeping a player eligible.

Mike Gonzalez 36:40

You know, when when you first thought about coming over here to uh play golf, was it even a thought in your mind yet that you might do this for a living?

Karen Stupples 36:49

No, not at all. I I knew I weren't wanted to work within the golf industry. I had a feeling that it would probably be uh as a as a golf pro in a club like Andrew. Um I figured that I would probably be quite good at that. Um there were so many because I hadn't achieved I hadn't won the English, I hadn't won the British, I hadn't won any of those big amateur events. Um and a lot of people, a number of people said to me, Oh, you know, maybe you should get a proper job, you can never make a living playing golf. Um, and so you know, in the back of your mind, you think, Well, I I don't even know what I'm doing. And the ladies' European tour wasn't particularly strong. Um, there wasn't a huge amount of opportunities. And so I thought, well, I'll just, you know, I'll I'll try and play golf and do what I'm doing. But then when I got out to Florida State and to Arkansas State, I realized there's a whole nother tour over here. There's the LPGA tour. Yeah, and they're playing all over the place and they're making decent money. So all of a sudden, my eyes were opened as soon as I came out here to America that of what the potential could be. And uh I remember enjoying my time here in America so much that I went to one of my guidance counsellors at Florida State and I said, Hey, no, how do I stay? How do I get to stay here? I I you know, I I like America, I want to be here. She said, Well, best you get really good at golf.

Mike Gonzalez 38:16

That's great advice. Yeah. Yep. So I I'm sure in some respects, playing in the NCAAs was a proper yardstick in measuring your game and your progress against your peers. But as you started playing in some fairly serious amateur team competitions, I'm sure that exposed you to some people that were quite good from various parts of the world as well. I'm talking about uh Curtis Cup uh participation, I'm talking about Vagliano trophy participation. Uh uh you participated with some good teams, some good players, and that probably was another good benchmark for you, wasn't it?

Karen Stupples 38:57

It was. Um and it's funny because I look back on my time and I it's like I really wish that I had believed in myself a little more than I did, um, because I was actually pretty good. Um but I always felt like I wasn't as good as the others. And so um I I enjoyed it and I saw where I could go, but it was in some respects very good for me because it kept me pushing forward, it kept me wanting more, I kept wanting to improve. And that that that same feeling that I had from a young girl of wanting to get better has always been there. Like and no matter what level I got to, there was always something more, there was always more that I wanted. I wanted to be better still.

Mike Gonzalez 39:42

So t tell us a little bit about your Curtis Cup experience.

Karen Stupples 39:47

Oh, that was amazing. Um the the first one I played in was in Kalani, and uh we ended up winning. Uh Kelly Booth, Christy Kerr were on the American team, Brenda Corey Keane, you know, a number of really tremendous players. Um I I won one, I lost one. You know, I had a bit of an up and down time of it, but I one of the biggest things I remember was, and this is probably nothing that health and safety would be very proud of or very happy with, but all of the team were piled on one golf cart driving down the 18th fairway. And we were all piled on there and we were all singing, we are the champions, and it was just I mean, it was it was magnificent. I mean, you know, winning as a team is is something it really is, and you you don't get that uh when you're doing it just for yourself. But the next time the Curtis Cup we lost. So I got the feeling of how how tough that was, and you know, my lasting memory of of the my second Solheim Cup was at which was at Minicar and in Minnesota, was playing Carol Semple Thompson in the singles. And and we'd had an up and down game. Now Carol is is a magnificent lady, you know, she has been there, done it in the world of amateur women's golf, she is the gold standard, and so I'm playing against her, and I and the my one regret, and she would kick me for saying it, because she said no, it it should never be a regret, was that I made her putt a couple of feet putt on the last, I mean it was probably about a three-footer on the last to tie the match, and she and she missed it, so I ended up winning the match. But I I felt bad that I'd made her putt it. I should I should have given it to her, we should have halved because it was such a good match. Yeah, uh, but she will say, No, you absolutely should have made me putt it. I would have made you putt that too. But uh that was my memory, my lasting memory of Medicata. But we lost. Yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 41:50

Yeah.

Karen Stupples 41:50

At least they won.

Mike Gonzalez 41:52

Bruce, I I look, I look back at that. I'm just trying to get a mental picture of that cart ride down 18 with all the numbers on the cart. We are the champions. Yeah, you know, pre-Tik tocks. There's probably no videos around of that, are there?

Karen Stupples 42:09

I don't know. I think there are pictures of it somewhere.

Mike Gonzalez 42:12

Are there?

Karen Stupples 42:12

There has to be a picture somewhere. Yeah, I'm pretty sure there was a picture snapped of it.

Mike Gonzalez 42:17

We're we're gonna look for that. Uh well, that was a precursor then, of course, so we'll talk at Solheim Cup later, but uh, you know, to get a little taste of that high-level team competition, that's a little different pressure, isn't it?

Karen Stupples 42:29

Oh yeah, no question about it. Because when you're playing for yourself, it doesn't you know, you're only letting yourself down. You know, if if you don't perform to your standard, it's it's yourself and it's only it's only you that that can be fed up about it. But for some reason, when you're part of a team, you you want to achieve for everybody and you feel the responsibility of everybody. But not only that, there's a sense of knowing that you are your country's representative as part of that team. Of all the golfers that play golf in Great Britain and Ireland, I was one of the best ones that I had been picked to represent every single female golfer in Great Britain and Ireland in that match. And that I think that sense of gravity isn't lost on you when you stand on that first tee in your match.

Mike Gonzalez 43:22

Thank you for listening to another episode of For the Good of the Game. And please, wherever you listen to your podcast on Apple and Spotify, if you like what you hear, please subscribe, spread the word, and tell your friends until we tee it up again for the good of the game. So long, everybody.

Intro Music 43:46

It went smack down the fairway. And it started just like just smack off line. In the state, you're okay. Went straight down the middle, quite away.