Nanci Bowen - Part 1 (The Early Years)

Music playing  00:00

Mike Gonzalez  00:15

Welcome to another edition of FORE the Good of the Game and Bruce Devlin, I guess if you've got to pick one tournament to win, it might as well be a major championship.

Devlin, Bruce  00:24

Well, isn't that the truth and this particular one probably has seen more changes in the LPGA than any other golf tournament, aside from maybe some of the other majors. But this young lady was born in Tifton, Georgia, and she was the winner of the 1995 Dinah Shore, four other victories as a professional golfer and it's a thrill to have Nanci Bowen with us this morning, Nanci, thanks.

Bowen, Nanci  00:51

Well, this is fantastic. I love being here. And I really like what you guys are doing.

Devlin, Bruce  00:57

Well. Thank you.

Mike Gonzalez  00:57

Nancy, thanks for joining us. And I guess we were going to talk about that major in some detail. But to win the Dinah Shore, and by the way, it might have been called something different that year, because the names have changed, right?

Bowen, Nanci  01:12

Right. It was the Kraft Nabisco, Dinah Shore is what it was at the time. 

Mike Gonzalez  01:17

We always call it The Dinah Shore just so there's no confusion.

Bowen, Nanci  01:21

Exactly. Even though it's the Chevron now, I think. Yeah,

Mike Gonzalez  01:24

But just you know, as we'll talk about the the great history of that event, for women, it was transformative when it came on board in the early 70s. And, to win that one, probably extra special.

Bowen, Nanci  01:36

Absolutely, yes, it was. I wasn't really playing all that great leading up to it. But everything clicked together that week. So it was it was really exciting. And if you're gonna pick one, it was the first time I had ever played the Golf Course, too. So it was it was quite the the exciting week for me.

Mike Gonzalez  01:57

Well, we're gonna take our listeners through it. But before we do, we've got to talk about the early years. And as you know, having listened to a few of these episodes, we'd like to take you back to your early beginnings when you got acclimated and introduced to the game. And as Bruce mentioned at the top, you were born in Tifton, Georgia, take us back to those early years.

Bowen, Nanci  02:19

Yeah, well, I was really lucky I, my father was a really good player. And he taught me how to play kept it really, really simple. And I absolutely loved the game, we lived on a Golf Course I was able to, to get to the Golf Course pretty easily. So I started when I was about eight years old. And my parents were a little older than the average parents, they were 41 and 44 When I was born, so I have older siblings that are like 18, 15 and 13 years older. So really, it was just me. And my dad had a lot of time to spend with me. So that was that was really good for me. And I went through and and started playing and just loved it. And from that point on, I played on the high school boys golf team. There were no girls golf teams. Actually, there were hardly any girls that played in the state much back in the 80's, 70's and 80's. And I just kept playing and earned a scholarship to the University of Georgia. And it just kind of went from there.

Mike Gonzalez  03:21

So you were kind of right on the cutting edge of Title Nine, it coming in stream writers, as we've talked about with a lot of guests, you know, in terms of access, it's not unusual that we've talked to ladies like yourself that if they had an opportunity to compete at a young age on a university or high school team, it was typically on the men's team or the boys team.

Bowen, Nanci  03:42

That's correct. Just about everybody that I knew I don't I can't really think of a player that played on the LPGA tour that was on a girls golf team. There might have been some I mean, younger than me. Yes. Older than me. I don't think so. So yes, we actually because, you know, I went to the University of Georgia and the SEC, I don't even think South Carolina was in the SEC back then. And now of course, Auburn didn't have a golf team. And, you know, it was just starting a golf team. I actually visited there, but Georgia was definitely where I was going. My mother graduated there. My brother, my sister, sister in law, nieces. So we're big Georgia Bulldog fans.

Mike Gonzalez  04:28

So what attracted you to the game at an early age?

Bowen, Nanci  04:31

You know, do something about it. And my dad was a great player, single digit handicap. He wanted to stay in high school. So I just loved that we watched my mother was big into she's played as well. Not as good but she played and she loves sports. So that's where I really got to be really into sports, football, golf, tennis, whatever it was. And so from there, I just love the game. There's just something about Know that you're playing against yourself. And you know, back then you're trying to hit it far enough that you could ride, drop the golf cart to the next shot. That was kind of the motivation at an early age so you didn't have to, you know, walk to the ball, you want to hit it far enough that you could actually get in the car and drive to the next shot. And it just kind of went from there. I absolutely love the game I love you know, from the smell of the cut grass. You know, I mean, we've all been there and how nice it is how quiet it is. My friends, you know, give me a hard time about Yeah, we got to be Nanci's sport is so quiet. We got to be quiet one it's the place where everybody else was playing basketball and soccer and softball was really loud. I just enjoy the the whole atmosphere.

Devlin, Bruce  05:44

Well, you did touch on on what was going to be my next question about playing other sports we found that's pretty common amongst all of our great players. So did you participate as a younger person in in, in other sports at all?

Bowen, Nanci  05:59

I didn't on an organized team I just did for fun. I played tennis, one of my good friends in high school was on a tennis team. And so we would play a lot of tennis together. But no, my dad really frowned upon me playing other sports. He didn't want me to get hurt or injured. So I really just played golf, as far as organized sports. That was that was pretty much it. It was all I did. And loved every second of it. I was you know, my parents were not the type to push me. But they, you know, my dad motivated me I had to shoot even par from the men's tees in order to get a car when I turned 16. So that was motivation to go and play. And I finally I didn't do it on my birthday. But I did it a few months later. So but you know, they basically had to call me and come to dinner because you know, I'd be out there forever. Now just loved it. Absolutely loved it.

Mike Gonzalez  06:58

That sounds familiar that I can remember the days of my youth too, a little nine hole course. And and as you say being out there forever, it was 18 holes, maybe 27 holes, maybe go to the pool to the cool off. And then you're right back out there and putting under the moonlight. 

Bowen, Nanci  07:16

Oh, absolutely. And you know, we weren't, we didn't know much about hydration back then either. You know, we didn't have all the the water bottles that they have today. I remember just, you know, we're trying to make it to the water fountain in the middle of the Golf Course. And in the 95 degree heat down in South Georgia, carrying our bag and walk in, like you said 27, sometimes 36 holes.

Mike Gonzalez  07:38

You mentioned something that brings up some memories for me as a youth. You talked about various aspects of the game, including Just the smell of cut grass. Some of my memories from I'm just thinking about high school matches, for example, weren't so much. shots or or sights. It was the smell.

Bowen, Nanci  08:02

Yes, absolutely. And also playing in the rain. There's a certain smell for that, too. I just love that. That freshly cut grass, right when you're teeing off in the morning in a tournament, it's, you know, it's just something that's unique to our sport. Yeah,

Mike Gonzalez  08:18

it may be around that you're playing through pine trees. And that sort of is what you remember. But that's just it just sort of conjured up some cool memories. So, so Bruce always likes to ask about some of your early influences in terms of players, you followed players you watch players that taught you.

Bowen, Nanci  08:38

Well, obviously Nancy Lopez was a big influence. She was living in Albany, Georgia, when she was married to Ray Knight, which is only 45 minutes from Tifton. And I remember my mom coming to get me out of school, but she never did that. So I figured somebody had died. And she's like Nancy Lopez is playing at the Golf Course. And we're gonna go watch her play. And so they got me out of school, and I was able to go watch her and meet her. And that was just like, oh my god, this is the coolest thing ever. And I realized quickly, you know that I had a long way to go watch it or play to watch. TV was so good. But it was an ever since I mean to this day, she's still such a wonderful person. And even when I was on tour, my rookie year, I remember staying at her house, along with some other players were doing her her pro app for her charity. And I remember her wanting to show us her Hall of Fame video. And there was this really big oversized chair and I remember sitting in it and she came and sat in the big chair with me. I'm like, I mean, pinch me. You know, this is like wow, you know, dreams come true. Not only have I met my idol, but I'm now becoming friends with her and it was, you know, she's just a really special person.

Mike Gonzalez  10:02

And she was a big deal wasn't she.

Bowen, Nanci  10:05

She was, but you know, it's really interesting. I remember being at a pro and party with her with her daughter Ashley and Ashley as her oldest and Ashley was very young. And she was going around getting everybody's autograph. She didn't realize that her mom was such a big deal as he was asking for my autograph. And I'm like, this is really kind of funny.

Mike Gonzalez  10:23

How old were you when you met her,

Bowen, Nanci  10:26

I was in eighth grade, I believe. So what is that? 14, something like that. When I first met her 141, 5. And she's just the same as she was back then.

Mike Gonzalez  10:38

Made an impression on you.

10:39

Oh, Absolutely and I think she does with anybody she meets. She really is a special person. She's real.

Mike Gonzalez  10:49

And I love Kathy Whitworth quote, which is that, you know, if Mickey Wright was our Ben Hogan, Nancy Lopez was our Arnold Palmer.

10:58

That's a really good analogy. I would agree with that. Yes. Yes. Kind of like Annika is our Tiger. Right?

Devlin, Bruce  11:10

So Tiff County High School, and I'm looking at your record 81, 82, 83, 84. Georgia Girls State Junior Champion four years in a row. That's pretty fancy to start with as a young player.

11:25

Yeah, sounds good. I was pretty good back then. Yeah. You know, again, it was special. I met some really neat people back then. Unfortunately, back then there weren't tons of women playing golf or young girls playing. But nonetheless, I came out on top even with a few I think you know, Cindy Schrier, who was before me, she won it I believe, and so you know, there was a lot of, you know, good players that came behind me Vicki Goetz is another big Georgia player they came. So you know, we have we have a few all of us that went to Georgia to University of Georgia, but it's, it's special to be able to say that you've you've done that four years in a row. So that was pretty special.

Mike Gonzalez  12:11

Did Hollis Stacy hail from the Savannah area? I don't remember.

12:15

Yes. Anne Stacy was on the golf team. And not sure about Martha Stacy, where she went to school, but Anne played. So there's a bunch of Stacy's they can play tennis and golf. Yeah,

Mike Gonzalez  12:34

yeah. So as Bruce mentioned for straight at the Georgia Girls State junior, and then you had some good experiences and other some big tournaments as well, you you made it to the semi finals of the 1987 U.S. Amateur that was played up at Rhode Island Country Club. What are your memories of that championship?

12:52

Well, I just remember playing some really tough amateur players up there, but the person I ran into that beat me was Kay Cockerill. Okay, was a great player. And so, yeah, made it to the semis and beat her or she beat me and, you know, she's a student playing really good golf back then. And it didn't translate her amateur record was was pretty good. And, you know, I don't think she had obviously the pro career that she had wanted, but she's a fantastic commentator. So that has really worked out well for her.

Mike Gonzalez  13:32

That she sure is and we'll be sure to tag her on Twitter. So that okay, your episode A mentioned when we released your story.

13:41

Right right? Yeah, she Yeah, she's, uh, she was about I remember her putting really well, she's a great putter, and just, you know, she was playing really well and ended up winning it. So

Mike Gonzalez  13:54

Now had you played in any USGA championships leading up to that one?

Bowen, Nanci  13:57

Yeah, I had, I played some junior USGA, nothing special. And I wasn't accustomed to match play. And so I was starting to get into it. But that year, you know, I was just playing. I was playing well, and, you know, with all the college golf that I was playing, and then that just kind of went right into the amateur summer season. So yes, it was a it was a lot of fun. And, you know, met a lot of really neat people. And a lot of these players that played obviously went on and played on the tour as well. So,

Mike Gonzalez  14:32

Yeah, so if we talk about 1987, you're now 20 years old, I guess. So you're, you're getting a little deeper into your college career. You're probably what coming off your junior year maybe?

Bowen, Nanci  14:43

Right? Yeah. Or going into somewhere right in there. Right? Because the following year is when they played played the Trans National, which is essentially the same people were playing in that tournament as well.

Devlin, Bruce  14:59

Who won that by the way?

Bowen, Nanci  15:00

I did sneak in there. I remember beating Caroline Kegge. on that one. She also played on the tour. So that was a lot of fun enjoyed Green Bay. Just before we played that one. So that was a lot of fun.

Mike Gonzalez  15:22

Now speaking of Green Bay, I think the Green Bay Chamber of Commerce was involved in initially sponsoring the first three years of the Ladies Legends Tour, were they not?

Bowen, Nanci  15:31

You know, it very well could be not familiar because I wasn't playing back then. Because I really haven't played much on the legends tour. So, I'm not familiar with that. But um, you know, it's a great area. And, you know, Wisconsin, you know, we also played the U.S. Open up at Blackwolf Run, so they have some good golf courses up there. I'm not I have not played Whistling Straits, which I understand is a really good place, but they have some great golf courses up there. 

Devlin, Bruce  16:01

Whistling Straits looks too tough for me.

Bowen, Nanci  16:06

Blackwolf Run, I think was the hardest course I've ever played and the USGA was setting it up to so they, they tend to make it very difficult. I

Mike Gonzalez  16:17

used to live in Milwaukee for a while. One year, we went up to Kohler and played our first round of golf that season. You know, so March, April, I don't know, on one of the two Blackwolf Run courses. I don't remember now. But I agree with you. Of course, it was first round so I had some excuses but I mean, you had to be very precise, particularly with your approach shots, as I recall there. 

Bowen, Nanci  16:41

Well, and your drive. I mean, it was you could be dead at either side of the fairway, either side of the green. It was just I was exhausted playing that Golf Course. I mean, you just were spent after hitting all those shots and the USGA, you know, they like to make it tough. So they the rough was up, the greens were fast. And I think Se Ri Pak ended up winning that one. And that started her career.

Mike Gonzalez  17:10

My wife and I went up for that playoff on the Monday, which was a terrible viewing experience for 20,000 people trying to follow two people, right.

Bowen, Nanci  17:19

Yeah, yeah. It's not a friendly Golf Course for spectators.

Mike Gonzalez  17:23

It was tough. But that's the one that Jenny, the amateur had made that bomb on 18 to get into that play off.

Bowen, Nanci  17:34

She did. Yeah. She actually took lessons from my golf. Instructor, Ted Sheftic. So I got to know her a little bit. So yeah. And then, you know, she quickly did not kind of go down that pro golf thing. For her. She, she did other things. But she was a, that was quite the moment for her

Mike Gonzalez  17:55

Well speaking of U.S. Opens, you had a chance as an amateur to play and several of them, didn't you?

Bowen, Nanci  18:01

I did I qualified for my first one when I was 18. And that was I mean, I was very naive. I think my first round I shot 76. And then I don't even know what I taught my second round, but I just remember, wow, how intimidating is the first time I'd played where you need to have the ropes up and I just remember looking out there just I was a nervous wreck. A good friend of mine was caddying for me and, you know, we just took it all in but it was the US Open is intimidating. I don't know why it is, but it just is. It's a little different than any other tournament. And, you know, I was able to play in that and they, they just, they just set it up hard. They remember playing a practice round. It was actually the first round and one of my teammates was playing and the roof was so thick another teammate was caddying for her and they set the bag down to go get yardage and they lost the bag in the rough. I mean, it took them a while just to find the golf bag. I mean, that's just kind of that was at Indianwood up at Detroit. So yeah, you know, us opals are tough. It never did fit my game. I remember Patty Sheehan,  I was playing with her one time and she's like you should play really well in a U.S. Open because he you know, pretty accurate and I said yeah, I just don't hit it far enough. And the U.S. Open is always long, and it's not really receptive to hitting long irons or long woods into the green for your second shot. So yeah, I think I have played 15 of them and have all made the cut and all of the Senior Women's Opens but I probably only made half the cuts when I was playing the regular U.S. Open it just it was just really hard and it just didn't quite fit me like the Mission Hills Dinah Shore course fits me a little better.

Mike Gonzalez  19:54

You go back to that first one you mentioned at age 18 you're coming off 18 having posted a seventy-six. With that pressure. With that setup, you probably felt pretty good about that round.

Bowen, Nanci  20:06

I did feel good. I think I had bigger expectations, and I didn't quite know how to handle it. Like, as you get older, you understand, but yes, I was proud of the way I played that first round. And, you know, every, every open that you play, you feel like you're you're just you're learning a little bit more, and you're getting better at it. But, you know, I'll remember another U.S. Open again, it was at Indianwood. We played there twice. And I think Helen Alfredsson shot 64 the first day, and we're all sitting in the locker and going you know, the USGA does not like it when you go under par. So we knew that the pin placements the next day, we're just going to be impossible, which they were because she shot 64 So we're we were mad at her for shooting so low.

Mike Gonzalez  20:55

Probably the first time you're there, Betsy King, I think one. Yes, that's right. Second time you there. Patty Sheehan. I think one that's about right had been coming off her meltdown down in Atlanta.

Bowen, Nanci  21:08

Right, right. Right. I remember. She it was really hot down there. And actually, I think Dottie Pepper was even playing well, there's a lot of good, you know, obviously, the big names were up there playing well,

Mike Gonzalez  21:23

We talked about your 76 and you felt okay about that. Actually, you didn't know it at age 18 but you still could have won because we've talked to two Hall of Famers that shot higher than 76 in their first round and came back to win the U.S. Open.

Bowen, Nanci  21:37

Yeah, I don't think I was mentally tough enough nor mature enough to win at 18. But you know, it was it was great. It was a great learning experience. I had I had a lot of fun. I learned so much met a lot of really neat people. And, you know, like I said the U.S. Open. It's just it's so tough. And but if you can, anybody that wins an Open, you know, they've really they've played every club in the bag, for sure.

Devlin, Bruce  22:06

So tell us a little bit about your coach Ted Sheftic. You mentioned him earlier. That's a name that I do not know. So I'd like to know a little bit about him.

Bowen, Nanci  22:18

Well Ted,  he's based in Pennsylvania. And he, he just, he met him through another friend of mine that was taking lessons from because I'd only taken had my dad teach me how to play until I was actually out on tour. And so Ted just became, you know, it's almost like part of the family would go up and stay at his house. And he would, you know, really take a soul. And there's quite a few of the players on tour that went and stayed with him and played. And he's he was just just a great guy. He was he was golf 24/7 We always laughed about the fact that we there needed to be two or three of us taking lessons at the same time just to spread out the day because he had where he out. And then at night, we'd be talking about it. So and his wife was wonderful, and she always cook really nice dinners. But he's, you know, he had his own. He was also the head pro at a teaching pro. And he had his own little he built a little shed and had golf stuff in his shed. So he he really was a big time into golf, his son now as a teaching pro, and has played in the PGA of America, the PGA Championship, through that, the teaching division, so he's, uh, you know, they're, they're big into golf, and he's just a super, super guy. And he knew I knew him enough to know what to take out or what he gave me to think about without getting overwhelmed. And he was, he was just a great coach for me.

Mike Gonzalez  24:01

So at what age do you did you start thinking about maybe doing this for a living?

Bowen, Nanci  24:05

I think that's what I always wanted to do in the back of my head. But my parents were like, you know, you have to get a college degree. studied and studied journalism, public relations. So I have a degree in that. And so, but I knew I wanted to talk Pro. So as soon as I graduated, I turned pro, and I did not get my card. The first time I went through Q school, and then of course, we think you have what was at 22, 23 So you think your life is over? And then I played the mini tour. And that's when I got my first when was out there. And that's when you start learning the ropes. You know, that's, you know, all of us that played the mini tour. You know, it's, you really have to grind it out out there. This is not glamorous, and it's a lot of hard work, a lot of travel that's as the regular tours as well. But I kind of got my feet wet. And then I qualified for the tour after that season and played two years, but I, you know, I was like a fish out of water. So I lost my card after the second year 1992. So I went back to the mini tour, played the Asian tour. I did, we did five weeks over in Malaysia, Indonesia, Singapore, Thailand, and Taiwan, and then came back. And my, my coach Ted in us, he saw, you know, well, I set the goal for being a player of the year. And I said, Okay, so that's what we set out to do. And that's what I ended up doing. I had, I think, two wins out there. And so it was it was, I think, that was in the top 10 Every week, except once I was 11th. So everything, I just felt like a big fish in a little pond. And then I got my, then I got through Q school again. And then by 1994, I really felt confident and that I belonged out on the LPGA. And then back then in order to get into the Dinah Shore, you had to finish in the top three was one of the ways to get in. And I finished third at the the JAL at Wykagle in New Rochelle, New York. And that propelled me into the dinosaur the following year. kind of went went from there.

Mike Gonzalez  26:31

Well, let's step back to that first when that I think that was on the Futures Tour at the 1990 Christa McAuliffe.

Bowen, Nanci  26:37

Right. That was that was in Pennsylvania. I remember talking about bad rounds. The last round on the first hole, a double bogeyed the first hole. But I hung in there and then had five birdies coming in. Let's see, like 13, 14, 15, 16 and 17. I've birdied those five hole and kind of went away with it at that point. So it was definitely meant to be. So that kind of jump started me and and I felt like okay, I can I can do this.

Mike Gonzalez  27:12

Probably didn't come with a real big check. But I bet it felt good.

Bowen, Nanci  27:15

I think I won $8,000. Which to me back then you felt like, you know, you won the lottery. That was real money. Absolutely in 1990. Yeah. So yeah, it felt it felt good. It felt like you know, I belong. So I can do this.

Mike Gonzalez  27:39

So that first cup of coffee on the tour between stints on the Futures Tour? What did you learn?

Bowen, Nanci  27:47

Gosh, I learned that I had to get better. For starters, I learned that I started working on a sports psychologist. And that really helped a lot to kind of get my thoughts in the right place. And so that carried over and when I was out on the, you know, what, I lost my card. And went back to the mini tour that really helped me identify what I needed to work on how to better prepare for tournaments. And also, when to rest. I think a lot of players especially when we're first starting out, you feel like you have to play every week. And you still see it today, you know, and when actually you should take a week off and go kind of rest and rejuvenate and then come back out. But so I learned a lot about about that.

Mike Gonzalez  28:42

That's interesting when you you kind of framed it up at the beginning, when I found out I had to get better, but it's not just necessarily hitting golf shots. You mentioned a lot of other things that go beyond hitting golf shots. Well,

Bowen, Nanci  28:54

you know, back when I was playing, and even before me, you know, we didn't have teams of people. We were our own travel agent. We were, you know, we did everything. You know, we were I remember. I remember, I was doing laundry and a laundromat as we all did. And I had my clean laundry. I was walking into the hotel and ran into Beth Daniel. And she goes, I'll pay you to do my laundry and I just said, Oh, Beth, you can't afford me. And she said yes, I can. So, you know, those, there's just so much you have to do that, you know, people that watch TV and they see the players now, they have teams of people doing everything for him from nutrition to fitness to you know, per the instructors, you know, long game instructor. I mean, it just goes on and on. And, you know, that's, you know, agents, of course, but, you know, the women's tour is quite a bit different than the men's tour. We just don't have quite as much of that but today is Much better than it was when we were all playing and but all we had to do.

Mike Gonzalez  30:05

So you started working on some of the things you felt you needed to work on to get yourself better, went back out on the futures tour. And as you mentioned, 93 had a very good year, it was a player of the year, kind of year on the futures tour with a couple of wins.

Bowen, Nanci  30:18

Yes, yes. You know, I just remember putting was key. I mean, I've always been pretty accurate. But, you know, not that I hit everything straight and perfect. But that's is probably the strength of my game. But putting is really when I put well always played well. So that was key for me. And that whole year, I just played it really well. And that's what kept me in it. And you know, the two wins that I did have, it was just a matter of making a lot of putts.

Mike Gonzalez  30:51

You won the 1993 Toledo Bend Futures Classic. And then the Colony Creek Futures Classic. What do you remember about those two events?

Bowen, Nanci  30:59

Not a lot. I remember. The first one was in Louisiana somewhere. I don't even remember exactly where it was. And it was in the middle of nowhere. But the second one in Texas, I remember we had some, there were some pretty good storms, you know, then in Texas, Victoria, Texas. And we I just remember, we were staying in a house and housing and a lot of neat people, players that I was staying with and we just had, it was a lot of fun. Both of those weeks, I was having fun. And I think that is another reason I played so well just relax, having fun. And just enjoy and you know, joy in the moment, which I think is key for playing well.

Mike Gonzalez  31:48

So Player the Year of status, I guess on the Futures Tour in 1993 earned you a seat at the table again, the big table. So tell us a little bit about you coming back to the LPGA Tour in 94 And how your game was developing then, leading up to your biggest moment that following year.

Bowen, Nanci  32:09

Well, you know, Ted and I were really working on my swing. And I felt like the one thing that I had to work a lot on was my impact position. It was a little bit weak. And so really trying to be a better ball striker. And so we I was continually working on that. And it was it was becoming easier and easier as the year went along. And again, when I finished third, at Wykagle it was putting I just made a lot of pots. And that whole year, you know, just being able to, you know, strike the ball better and make putts is was really the key for me. So I just was able to keep that go on throughout the year. And, you know, I was working with my sports psychologist and, you know, working on things that you always hear about like stay in the process and not the outcome, a lot easier said than done. It's like one shot at a time. lot easier said than done. Everybody works on it. But it's so hard. But it was becoming easier and easier. And I had tools along the way, you know, what do I have control over? And those were things that I worked on constantly, so it was a lot of mental approach as well.

Mike Gonzalez  33:25

Thank you for listening to another episode of FORE the Good of the Game. And please, wherever you listen to your podcast on Apple and Spotify if you like what you hear, please subscribe, spread the word and tell your friends. Until we tee it up again, FORE the Good of the Game, So long, everybody.

Music playing  33:44